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Johnnygu
11-11-2011, 09:39 PM
I disagree with the negative posts about the game (and I'm not a happy go lucky always positive fan), although the three ball is a concern for us....Gonzaga played fine for the first game of the season and have loads of potential for this year.

EWU DESERVES CREDIT ON THIS ONE. They played to win, they're pretty athletic, they hit shots, played pretty good D.

willandi
11-11-2011, 09:44 PM
I disagree with the negative posts about the game (and I'm not a happy go lucky always positive fan), although the three ball is a concern for us....Gonzaga played fine for the first game of the season and have loads of potential for this year.

EWU DESERVES CREDIT ON THIS ONE. They played to win, they're pretty athletic, they hit shots, played pretty good D.

Thanks. I agree. When you've nothing to lose, playing hard 'til you foul out is easy!

cggonzaga
11-11-2011, 09:55 PM
I give credit for Hayford outcoaching our staff and turning it into as ugly a game as they possibly could. Eastern is not a very talented team but they do play very hard. That being said, not a whole lot to like about the Gonzaga basketball program tonight.

Johnnygu
11-11-2011, 10:07 PM
If EWU plays like that every game(which I know they won't)....they would be my choice to win their conference.

"Not a whole lot to like"? Harris is clearly improved player this year (15 foot bank shot surprised me lol)...Its clearly the start of the Pangos era, he had a great game for his first collegiate start....Sacre will be a free throw shooting machine this year....Carter looks very comfortable out there and they all look hungry for big things this year. THEY JUST HAVE TO NOT READ THIS BOARD AND THEY'LL BE OK HAHA

cggonzaga
11-11-2011, 10:11 PM
"Not a whole lot to like"? Harris is clearly improved player this year (15 foot bank shot surprised me lol)...Its clearly the start of the Pangos era, he had a great game for his first collegiate start....Sacre will be a free throw shooting machine this year....Carter looks very comfortable out there and they all look hungry for big things this year.

Actually that's fair.

ZagWhoShotLibertyValance
11-11-2011, 10:20 PM
just wanted to say props to EWU. Our team looked awful, with no continuity--the major plays were by individuals rather than team flow, but that had a lot to do with Hayford and his crew. nice job, eagles.

Johnnygu
11-11-2011, 10:21 PM
And if nothing else: Meech out, Pangos in...big time upgrade.
Pangos is very poised and careful with turnovers, hit a tough three in the second half, set his feet real quick. I like this kid.

(no offense to meech...or sean mallon, or zach gourde...or anyone else I've hated on over the years)

WallaWallaZag
11-11-2011, 10:29 PM
And if nothing else: Meech out, Pangos in...big time upgrade.

on the other hand, maybe a bigger problem is...steven gray out, mike hart in...

xjzico
11-11-2011, 10:35 PM
Come on, we've seen this before. There's so many ways around your explanation and number one is past performances. We have seen this before on a consistent basis verses lesser and superior teams. After this year it's not the players, as everyone knows we've recycled the squad several times over, so the only explanation is it sits squarely at the feet of the staff.

Johnnygu
11-11-2011, 10:40 PM
on the other hand, maybe a bigger problem is...steven gray out, mike hart in...

I think Mike Hart has a lot of value, but I don't know about 30 minutes valuable.

Dower needs more minutes and he will in big games.

I like Few's thinking with a streamlined rotation FINALLY!...hope he keeps it this way.

Johnnygu
11-11-2011, 11:21 PM
Come on, we've seen this before. There's so many ways around your explanation and number one is past performances. We have seen this before on a consistent basis verses lesser and superior teams. After this year it's not the players, as everyone knows we've recycled the squad several times over, so the only explanation is it sits squarely at the feet of the staff.

I'm quoting you, but I'm not directing the following statement towards you or anyone on the board.

I'll play this card, because I just feel its the absolute truth. THE AVERAGE COLLEGE BASKETBALL FAN LACKS PERSPERCTIVE. Why? Because they've never played. So all they have to go on is results and what happened the last game and what happened last year.

I think the people with perspective can see some significant changes this year:

-number one... the intensity level was great tonight from both teams. Thats the kind of intensity gonzaga has to have in the NCAAs, a butler like intensity
-we don't have a 150 pound stockton as our starting PG this year, we have a 170 pound stockton coming off the bench ( I know he technically started this game, but Pangos will eventually be the starter soon, I think people would agree with me)
-we don't have a hobbled Harris this year who looked like Patrick Ewing in the late nineties at times last year struggling down the floor, we have a Harris who is the best that we've ever seen, a Harris that scored more than half his points on dunks tonight
-we don't have a Carter thats trying to feel and find his way through his first major college basketball season, we have a Carter who has his S*it together and is ready to be a leader

bartruff1
11-12-2011, 04:50 AM
If EWU plays like that every game(which I know they won't)....they would be my choice to win their conference.

"Not a whole lot to like"? Harris is clearly improved player this year (15 foot bank shot surprised me lol)...Its clearly the start of the Pangos era, he had a great game for his first collegiate start....Sacre will be a free throw shooting machine this year....Carter looks very comfortable out there and they all look hungry for big things this year. THEY JUST HAVE TO NOT READ THIS BOARD AND THEY'LL BE OK HAHA Exactly...I would add that Carter made mistakes but played hard and of course we missed both Meech and Gray. Some people on this board just crack me up. Before we even play a single minute they are talking about FF's and after one game they are on suicide watch...I think they call that manic depressive ???:)

SunDevilGolfZag
11-12-2011, 05:28 AM
I disagree with the negative posts about the game (and I'm not a happy go lucky always positive fan), although the three ball is a concern for us....Gonzaga played fine for the first game of the season and have loads of potential for this year.

EWU DESERVES CREDIT ON THIS ONE. They played to win, they're pretty athletic, they hit shots, played pretty good D.

This is a great post that is well-grounded in reality and an understanding that EWU is a very well coached team with quality players. It was fun to see them compete at a high level -- kind of what sport should be all about. (To the posters bashing our team and coaches and not crediting the Eags for execution of their game plan: seems like arrogance unbefitting of the Zag fan, imo.)

titopoet
11-12-2011, 07:28 AM
I disagree with the negative posts about the game (and I'm not a happy go lucky always positive fan), although the three ball is a concern for us....Gonzaga played fine for the first game of the season and have loads of potential for this year.

EWU DESERVES CREDIT ON THIS ONE. They played to win, they're pretty athletic, they hit shots, played pretty good D.
Agreed and the played ugly (a good way to play against a team like GU) shoot the three and be physical. Play like a lot of teams do trying to catch up. This will help the young Zags learn. Good for humility for a young talented team.

Hoopaholic
11-12-2011, 08:09 AM
if "much improved" means having 5 turnovers as the off guard we will be in trouble

What concerned me was two fold:

team balance and flow on offense simply was not present. Some may try and claim it was EWU defense that forced this and I would disagree with that. The defense had NOTHING to do with 5 players standing around watching one person dribbling to back his man down (Garbage basketball you see at the NBA level---ie Sacre several times), nothing to do with the lack of motion on the offensive end, lack of off ball action (screens, backdoor cuts, V cuts, baseline slash). Standing around IS NOT going to be a productive offense for this team. I can only recall one HI LOW action....ONE for a team with such a great front line w e only did HI LOW ONCE all night.....

Offensive fluidity is partly because of lacking a true 3 wing player , but it is also due to not having a single wing or guard player wanting to step forward and be the "man" or focus for the offensive production out on the perimeter....without that type of action we MUST rely more on hi low actions, post to post screens and pick and roll actions


the second issue I had last night was our defense....it had more holes in it that my wifes sponge.....weakside rotation SIMPLY didnt exist last night. I wont even get into the number of times we were flat footed and taken to the hole by an EWU player. (Wont bother discussing guarding the 3 line as it has been beat to death). If we play like that against other teams we will have a serious foul issue amongst our bigs. THAT has to be cleaned up.

RenoZag
11-12-2011, 08:45 AM
Would you rather have a Carroll College kind of game (a cakewalk versus lesser competition ) to prepare you for WSU or the slugfest GU had last night against Eastern ?

I think EWU did us a favor. It's up to the coaches and the veterans to make it a teachable moment.

Baseline
11-12-2011, 08:47 AM
I'm quoting you, but I'm not directing the following statement towards you or anyone on the board.

I'll play this card, because I just feel its the absolute truth. THE AVERAGE COLLEGE BASKETBALL FAN LACKS PERSPERCTIVE. Why? Because they've never played. So all they have to go on is results and what happened the last game and what happened last year.

I think the people with perspective can see some significant changes this year:

-number one... the intensity level was great tonight from both teams. Thats the kind of intensity gonzaga has to have in the NCAAs, a butler like intensity
-we don't have a 150 pound stockton as our starting PG this year, we have a 170 pound stockton coming off the bench ( I know he technically started this game, but Pangos will eventually be the starter soon, I think people would agree with me)
-we don't have a hobbled Harris this year who looked like Patrick Ewing in the late nineties at times last year struggling down the floor, we have a Harris who is the best that we've ever seen, a Harris that scored more than half his points on dunks tonight
-we don't have a Carter thats trying to feel and find his way through his first major college basketball season, we have a Carter who has his S*it together and is ready to be a leader

I pretty much agree with your positives, but if all these are looking better, why did they look so bad? Every team doesn't have the full flow of the game, so why is Gonzaga struggling so much more. I will chalk this off as a team getting hot and willing to send us to the line. I do have an uneasy fealing that there are some missing peaces and we will struggle this year.

adoptedzag
11-12-2011, 08:57 AM
EWU's free throw defense was phenominal. We didn't have an answer for it all night.

TheGonzagaFactor
11-12-2011, 09:46 AM
EWU played terrible defense. If we hit free throws this would have been a blowout from start to finish. EWU was just hacking wildly. Very cheap, and they will not get away with that all year as they struggle to end up missing the Big Sky tourney as usual. No way they will ever shoot that well from 3 again. I know it was us they were playing, but they hit some shots they normally can't hit (I watch them from time to time). We overlooked them and it was their biggest game of the year.

gozags09
11-12-2011, 09:56 AM
I think that EWU did exactly what they wanted to do on defense. They didn't have the interior defenders to match up with RS and EH, so Hayford was willing to use as many guys as it took to stop easy shots.

Johnnygu
11-12-2011, 10:05 AM
I pretty much agree with your positives, but if all these are looking better, why did they look so bad? Every team doesn't have the full flow of the game, so why is Gonzaga struggling so much more. I will chalk this off as a team getting hot and willing to send us to the line. I do have an uneasy fealing that there are some missing peaces and we will struggle this year.

I'm not trying to say that Gonzaga looked sharp, they didn't. But the first game of the season is not when you expect to look like a well oiled machine. What I was looking for is individual pieces and what that might look like at the end of the season, and to me it looked encouraging.

Honestly, I think the people who are spewing the most negativity on these threads are the people who are coming down from their high and an irrational frenzy after watching the exhibition. They are bipolar posters haha.

Perspective-Michigan St. lost an exhibition to a Div II team to begin the season the last time they went to the Final Four(I think a couple years ago). I'm not saying Gonzaga is that good, but I'm saying good teams sometimes struggle to start.

No shame in playing a competitive game to a team that played as hard as EWU last night.

Johnnygu
11-12-2011, 10:18 AM
EWU was just hacking wildly.

And this was more in the second half, when they were tired and starting to show that they were outmatched athletically and had no answer for the size of Sacre.

I say it was a good defensive effort by EWU because the effort and intensity was off the charts...A plus.

EWU was going 100% all game which you don't see every game and is even more difficult to maintain that high level of effort through the whole season. But anytime a team does that, and they have some talent....guaranteed not to be a blowout, I don't care how good the team is they're playing.

Kiddwell
11-12-2011, 02:42 PM
EWU's game at UCLA (Dec 14th) will tell how good the Eagles really are. Hopefully good enough.

:]

Johnnygu
11-12-2011, 03:05 PM
UCLA will be a lot better by then as well. They are still 'finding their identity' as coaches would say. If UCLA doesnt have success this year, it will be a very hot seat for Howland.