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View Full Version : summer scrimage report: featuring incomming freshman



cair3
07-02-2007, 09:41 AM
wow. last night a buddy and i went to watch the incomming freshman scrimmage with the team. I consider theo davis to be a part of this freshman class. when sacre, daye and gray showed up you could feel the energy of the whole team pick up and we were in for a treat as the team played with the most intensity they have had all summer. zach gourde made a special appearance as well. Pargo, bouldin, and LG were all MIA pendo just iced his knee.
here is my break down of the players games:
1st my friend and i were most excited about the way hytvelt played. he actually had energy played hard on most plays, got upset about foul calls showed some senior leadership (basically all the things you wouldnt expect).
He also played real well. I remeber 2 years ago (josh's redshirt freshman year) when he was taking sacre around on a visit and sacre was bigger than josh, not anymore josh has really put on weight. last night he looked like an NBA 1st round prospect i just hope he can have the focus to play like that all the time.
Kuso: he plays like his attitude is "you all may be more talented than me but im going to be more productive anyways". One of the highlights was when he tried to dunk over sacre and sacre didnt shy away but tried to throw it back. ended up being a foul but was exciting to see neither one back down.

Sacre: defensively he is a Division one post deffender, a big paint pressence that is tough and wont back down. offensively he does a great job of getting position and really demanding the ball from the guards. he understands the idea of post positioning and really gets into the deffender. once he got the ball he was not that smooth but drew contact. he needs to become a better finisher, I am a little concerned about his jumping ability since he should have dunked a few that he just tried to lay up, got fouled and missed. deffensively he could be a star offensively he needs work but when he was out on the side he was practicing layups and mican drills.

foster: the other day when the intensity was a lot lower he looked pretty good, today with the intensity higher he did not. slow with his moves, got stripped a few times, couldn't really do anything against josh. BUT he did have a nice dunk on josh in transition. HE IS REALLY TALL

micah: nothing exciting, sorenson guarded him and did a good job limiting his touches, had a really nice ally oop lay in, can stroke it, he really needed a point guard.

ira "shark" brown: nothing exciting, played solid, had some nice layins and played hard but didnt stand out against steven gray.

austin daye: think tayshawn prince mixed with kevin durant. if kevin durant were paris hilton he'd be nicole richie, super skinny. Im pumped the zags got this kid, so confident, so smooth, handles are rediculous. Everything he does looks so easy, he has the longest arms in the world and quick hands. can score in a variety of ways, he might be unguardable at the college level. if he could just gain 15 pounds to weigh 150 he deffinitly would be. started out making good moves but just missed the shot. after he made his first shot he started to dominate, back door cut for an alley oop here, a curl and pop there, threepointer, cross over fifteen footer, put back. he made zach gourde look stupid, zach tried to body him and he just slipped by got into the key and did damage. smiles the whole time as he does what he wants. when the game would come down to game point he was the go to guy on the team. I cant decide what his role will be on this years team since his position is deepest compared to the other freshman but he may be too good to sit, i just dont know if we need such a talent yet.

theo davis: really athletic, has some guard skills but likes to post up. thin but strong. an energy guy with a real nice spin move. he has a pretty good shot. more talented than kuso but less productive, could use some weight.

steven graye: as expected does a little bit of everything, was 4/5 from three, looked confident but had that quiet demeanor, solid defense solid decision... could work on his handle. he is athletic but does not really try to use it. looks to be 6'3 or 6'4". a team player and a winner. nice pick up who will make a nice back up this year.

Andrew sorenson: played real well on defense, shoots well 3/4 from three... a less athletic version of gray needs to develope point guard passing ability and handles if he wants to play. brought the whole teams energy up.

this team is deep and good. to be a title contender they will need josh to be a 1st team all american, he has the potential but who knows if he can play up to it consistently.

TheZagPhish
07-02-2007, 09:49 AM
Thanks for the detailed breakdown. Keep 'em coming!

CDC84
07-02-2007, 10:17 AM
Sacre may have not been showing it, but he's got some hops for a big man. I doubt he has the hops of Josh, but he is quite athletic for a 7 footer......

Thanks for the detailed report Cair......

BTW...your analysis of Daye is right on the mark. The whole key with that kid is getting weight on him. He has just about everything else.

lothar98zag
07-02-2007, 10:19 AM
Thanks for the report!




Although I also wish he was heavier...

...austin daye...if kevin durant were paris hilton he'd be nicole richie, super skinny...if he could just gain 15 pounds to weigh 150 he deffinitly would be...

:roll: Funny stuff!



EDIT TO ADD: Is there a Daye highlight video on the internet somewhere?

lawzag
07-02-2007, 10:49 AM
what time do they scrimmage?
I have tomorrow off & thought I might drop by.

BobZag
07-02-2007, 04:16 PM
Unfortunately, not just anyone can go inside K2. It's kept off limits.

Not sure but Sacre may not have been coached to dunk as much as he should.

I was told weeks ago that Daye just might make us forget about Ammo in a few years.

Zach has lost a lot of weight, he can't be more than 220 now. Said he plays so many minutes in France that he just can't lug around what he once weighed.

Thanks, Cair3.

ZagNut08
07-02-2007, 04:40 PM
thanks for the updates care3

RebornZag
07-02-2007, 04:46 PM
Thanks for a great post Cair3. I've always had that image of Daye since I first saw his video clips. He appeared so quick for a guy his size. And he handles the ball like a guard. I'm sure the weight will come as he matures and works on that. What was his defense and boarding like?

Also a great report on Josh. I'm really, really proud of his hard work, and courage he has shown for rehabilitation. What if he turns out to be better BECAUSE of that incident in Cheney? What if it leads to the Zags first Final 4? Awesome baby. I've been watching reports on him carefully, and am glad for the weight gain. He needed it badly. Here's my question about Josh: Does he post down low more now? How was his defense?

Loved the report on Kuso as well. I was just asking about him recently. I've been thinking about him a lot because we've (including me) forgotten about him so easily. I also think back to how much JP improved between his Junior and Senior year at GU. Glad to see his intenisity is still there. I called him one of the 3 Gladiators on the team, and I can still see he is one. Don't count him out.

Great stuff on Davis as well. I do think he is going to add a lot to the team. I think sometimes we forget how good he once was. I think he was like around #36th best player on Scout.com in the country. He needs to get that level of play back. I think this crew will help him find it once again.

The report seemed good on Gray as well. Better than Ira?

What about LG? Where is he? I thought he was on campus.

What got me most excited was the intensity level created by the new guys. And that's exactly what they will create because as I've said, No one has it made now. They will be fighting for playing time. Sounds like the FIRE is back. As in days of old Zag lore.

Another question. Who played the point? What two guys? We've wondered what the team would be like if Jeremy and Matt didn't play. What were they like? Obviously, you say Downs missed them.

skan72
07-02-2007, 06:04 PM
wow. last night a buddy and i went to watch the incomming freshman scrimmage with the team. I consider theo davis to be a part of this freshman class. when sacre, daye and gray showed up you could feel the energy of the whole team pick up and we were in for a treat as the team played with the most intensity they have had all summer. zach gourde made a special appearance as well. Pargo, bouldin, and LG were all MIA pendo just iced his knee.
here is my break down of the players games:
1st my friend and i were most excited about the way hytvelt played. he actually had energy played hard on most plays, got upset about foul calls showed some senior leadership (basically all the things you wouldnt expect).
He also played real well. I remeber 2 years ago (josh's redshirt freshman year) when he was taking sacre around on a visit and sacre was bigger than josh, not anymore josh has really put on weight. last night he looked like an NBA 1st round prospect i just hope he can have the focus to play like that all the time.
Kuso: he plays like his attitude is "you all may be more talented than me but im going to be more productive anyways". One of the highlights was when he tried to dunk over sacre and sacre didnt shy away but tried to throw it back. ended up being a foul but was exciting to see neither one back down.

Sacre: defensively he is a Division one post deffender, a big paint pressence that is tough and wont back down. offensively he does a great job of getting position and really demanding the ball from the guards. he understands the idea of post positioning and really gets into the deffender. once he got the ball he was not that smooth but drew contact. he needs to become a better finisher, I am a little concerned about his jumping ability since he should have dunked a few that he just tried to lay up, got fouled and missed. deffensively he could be a star offensively he needs work but when he was out on the side he was practicing layups and mican drills.

foster: the other day when the intensity was a lot lower he looked pretty good, today with the intensity higher he did not. slow with his moves, got stripped a few times, couldn't really do anything against josh. BUT he did have a nice dunk on josh in transition. HE IS REALLY TALL

micah: nothing exciting, sorenson guarded him and did a good job limiting his touches, had a really nice ally oop lay in, can stroke it, he really needed a point guard.

ira "shark" brown: nothing exciting, played solid, had some nice layins and played hard but didnt stand out against steven gray.

austin daye: think tayshawn prince mixed with kevin durant. if kevin durant were paris hilton he'd be nicole richie, super skinny. Im pumped the zags got this kid, so confident, so smooth, handles are rediculous. Everything he does looks so easy, he has the longest arms in the world and quick hands. can score in a variety of ways, he might be unguardable at the college level. if he could just gain 15 pounds to weigh 150 he deffinitly would be. started out making good moves but just missed the shot. after he made his first shot he started to dominate, back door cut for an alley oop here, a curl and pop there, threepointer, cross over fifteen footer, put back. he made zach gourde look stupid, zach tried to body him and he just slipped by got into the key and did damage. smiles the whole time as he does what he wants. when the game would come down to game point he was the go to guy on the team. I cant decide what his role will be on this years team since his position is deepest compared to the other freshman but he may be too good to sit, i just dont know if we need such a talent yet.

theo davis: really athletic, has some guard skills but likes to post up. thin but strong. an energy guy with a real nice spin move. he has a pretty good shot. more talented than kuso but less productive, could use some weight.

steven graye: as expected does a little bit of everything, was 4/5 from three, looked confident but had that quiet demeanor, solid defense solid decision... could work on his handle. he is athletic but does not really try to use it. looks to be 6'3 or 6'4". a team player and a winner. nice pick up who will make a nice back up this year.

Andrew sorenson: played real well on defense, shoots well 3/4 from three... a less athletic version of gray needs to develope point guard passing ability and handles if he wants to play. brought the whole teams energy up.

this team is deep and good. to be a title contender they will need josh to be a 1st team all american, he has the potential but who knows if he can play up to it consistently.

Josh was pretty impressive, but not first round pick impressive. He also calls so many fouls when he is on offense, anytime he loses the ball or misses a layup he calls foul.

RebornZag
07-02-2007, 06:13 PM
Oh oh!! Don't like that kind of report on Josh, given by Scan72. I never liked guys who called a lot of fouls when in a pick-up game. It's one of the things I liked about playing without refs...it just made you tougher, especially when you play on the streets like I (and probably most people my age) did. That was a long time ago, back before AAU, and all that. I loved the streets. I moved back to Yakima and now live just a few blocks away from where I grew up playing. I take my grandson over there frequently, and he's beginning to love it too.

We'd call fouls if we got hammered, and I'm not going to say Josh gets or doesn't get hammered. Maybe guys clobber him, which hurts them on defense. But, we lived by the ethic of, "no blood no foul."

sittingon50
07-02-2007, 06:15 PM
Been watching a lot of tape from last year. Micah & Josh are the worst as far as SHOWING their displeasure over foul calls. That is a trait that they both need to lose; in a hurry.

Pendo is actually pretty bad too, but in his case I think he does get a lot of phantom calls. Same principle in effect with policeman writing more tickets to red cars.;)

Akzag
07-02-2007, 06:24 PM
Micah & Josh are the worst as far as SHOWING their displeasure over foul calls. That is a trait that they both need to lose; in a hurry.

Pendo is actually pretty bad too, but in his case I think he does get a lot of phantom calls.

As far as that goes, I think that MD and JH get upset when they don't get a call for them.

Pendo just gets upset when it called on him. (And damnit, a Zag never never commits a foul).

The main difference in my opinion, is that play is still going on when the first two would be whining - they should be hustling back on D.

But then Pendo can do no wrong in my book so ... :D

azzagfan
07-02-2007, 06:24 PM
This report makes me so excited I'm going to lace them up and go throw down on the 8' hoop down the street.:D

Scotto
07-02-2007, 07:11 PM
Great report!

As for Sacre, his legs may have been a little dead as he made the 7-8 hour drive down from Vancouver the same day. His defense alone will provide the perimeter players to play some tighter D knowing they have a great shot blocker behind them.

CDC84
07-02-2007, 07:44 PM
The other thing about Sacre is that he runs the floor excellently for a big man......

brasszag
07-02-2007, 08:30 PM
Pendo just gets upset when it called on him. (And damnit, a Zag never never commits a foul).

Best ever Zag to get fouled - Ronny... who could forget his hand shooting up in the air right after a whistle?

former1dog
07-02-2007, 08:46 PM
Best ever Zag to get fouled - Ronny... who could forget his hand shooting up in the air right after a whistle?

Agree.

Mallon was right up there as well.

I also don't remember Jim McPhee showing much of any emotion when he was called for a foul.

Scotto
07-02-2007, 11:11 PM
FYI... Sacre set the freshman record at Gonzaga yesterday for bench press. 14 x 185lbs.

jazzdelmar
07-03-2007, 02:02 AM
Reb, are u talking about the mean streets of Yakima???? Pretty funny image. PS: I spent a few months at the old Yakima Firing Center back in the day and don't recall any runs anywhere....As for the scrimmage: We are looking for seven-eight good men, tops. Depth after that tends to be irrelevant or even a problem for coaches (assuming no big injuries of c). So all these raves, while nice to hear, would be better distilled in 1 or 2 guys, as seems to be the case w Daye. As well, no mention of guard play.

tyra
07-03-2007, 05:37 AM
Let's see: This seven footer sets a freshman bench record (great strength) AND runs the court like a guard. Is it possible we haven't been talking enough about what impact this player may have in the next few years?

spudzag
07-03-2007, 05:49 AM
What a great thing to open practice from time to time and let factual observations find their way to the board. Seems like it would be better to have threads laced with first hand observations than third or forth hand speculation. Thanks to all who found out about the opening and attended. I received a couple reports outside the boards from guys who were just blown away by wha they saw.

former1dog
07-03-2007, 07:06 AM
As well, no mention of guard play.


Pargo and Bouldin weren't at the scrimmage.

HillBillyZag
07-03-2007, 09:03 AM
I think you will find that Rob Sacre has no trouble dunking the ball but seems to be a kid that knows when to hot-dog it and when to just do it right. Regardless of how much it wows the crowd and may/not intimidate the other team,its still only two, just like a regular lay-up.

RebornZag
07-03-2007, 09:23 AM
Jazzdelmar writes, "Reb, are u talking about the mean streets of Yakima???? Pretty funny image. PS: I spent a few months at the old Yakima Firing Center back in the day and don't recall any runs anywhere." :D

Thats funny Jazz! Never said "mean streets." Just streetball. And there was lots of it back then. Still is, but nowhere near the talent. The talented players today don't play streetball here. They're in AAU and playing in a highschool league when not in AAU tournaments. Back in THE DAY there was none of that. We all played outside or at the Y. Some of the guys who played at WSU (Wierman and Allen) didn't play on the streets much, but they did play on a park team in the Park Rec League. But there were some boys (if ya know what I mean here) who did play street ball, and A HECK OF A LOT OF IT. You'd be surprised to know who's out there playing sometimes.

And the armory. Now there was a gym, hugh? I just finished reading a Biography on Bob Hurley (Bobby's dad) at St. Anthony's in New Jersey. One heck of a book. They played in an armory too....it really brought back memories. Those MEMORIES associated with sports and Catholic Schools in the old days are really, really great memories.

cair3
07-03-2007, 09:49 AM
as far as guard play goes: sorenson, gray, daye, downs and ira all shared duties bringing up the ball. daye actually has the best handle of them all, gray acts the most like a point as far as setting others up, and sorenson does all the basics but lacks point guard play making ability (doesnt do much wrong just doesnt create things with his handle or passing). they all shot well from the outside especially gray and sorenson both only missing one three.

sacre does look real strong but he also looks like he could carry more weight and even be more effective. he really uses his stregnth on the court which I few as a positive but it may lead to foul trouble in the early parts of his time here.

daye made some good plays on defense getting steals and some nice boards using his legnth to snag some out of his area but he doesnt really box out and has some morrison in him when it comes to D; but i think he has more potential defensively especially with his legnth to bother people.


as far as watching them play: they usually play at night after camp is over, being that im a college kid I can just walk in looking like a camper no questions asked, if your an older guy you might have more trubble since its supposed to be open for the campers only. I'll be outta town the next few days but i plan on going down to see them play again probably next week and will give another report



The report seemed good on Gray as well. Better than Ira?

What about LG? Where is he? I thought he was on campus.
gray did not look better than the shark, but his shot was on and he made quite a few good plays, ira also made good plays he just was not as exciting as last time i saw him and has a thigh bruise that was bothering him.

summer session 1 just ended, i dont know where LG went but maybe he went home to visit the family between breaks, sounds like a good idea to visit cali for the 4th

ZagNative
07-03-2007, 10:09 AM
Cair, this is just really fun to read. I hope you'll be able to keep an eagle eye out for us when you get back.