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BobZag
12-12-2010, 11:01 AM
If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

If Marquise Carter adjusts from Juco to high level D1.

If Olynyk and Dower take the bit between the teeth and start playing tough.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

If the offense starts clicking and the defense starts gelling and the attitude turns to take-no-prisoners.

If these things happen, do you think the team will be good? Or is it simply impossible for any of these things to happen?

strikenowhere
12-12-2010, 11:14 AM
That is a lot of "ifs". Were they to all occur, I would think this team would be able to live up to all of the pre-season hype. However, I think the chances of everyone of those points occurring is slim to none, at least for just this year. By next year I would reckon that most of these improvements would have been made.

VaBeachZAG
12-12-2010, 11:16 AM
It's just simply too optimisitic to believe all of these will happen with this team, some will, some will not. Notwithstanding some good OOC games to come, I think we are off the national radar for the remainder of the season. Our only salvation for this season is to keep our tournament string alive. As others have pointed out, if you can get in the tournament (even as a 10/12 seed), anything can happen.

jazzdelmar
12-12-2010, 11:19 AM
ok rudyard, lotta "ifs" and no sign any will happen for sure......18-12

ZagLawGrad
12-12-2010, 11:19 AM
Well, you asked the question.

This team is not a bad team. But no use trying to pretend this team is on the verge of some kind of a major breakout. Blind allegiance to the Zags isn't going to change their win total now or over the next few months.

Even if all the things you hypothesize about were to happen, this team is still below the talent level of past Zags teams.

KO is not likely to toughen up any time soon.

Carter appears to be a bona fide whiff so far. If this was his first year of college b-ball, then maybe his play and skill level would be understandable.

As I recall, Harris didn't eactly set things on fire at the end of last season at crunch time, so maybe teams have just figured him out.

Based on the season to date, no reason to expect much from this team even on all cylinders. No Sweet Sixteen for sure.

Admittedly it is early, and anything can happen. But the evidence so far is not good.

RenoZag
12-12-2010, 11:19 AM
If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.
Possible. Looked like he's getting healthier. Still gets gassed in the second half

If Marquise Carter adjusts from Juco to high level D1.
Early indicators are he's not adjusting well

If Olynyk and Dower take the bit between the teeth and start playing tough.
Give KO's minutes to Dower & let him get some needed seasoning. Hard right now to use "tough" and "Olynyk" in the same sentence

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.
He's got grit; play him more

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.
Better him than Meech

If the offense starts clicking and the defense starts gelling and the attitude turns to take-no-prisoners.
Jury's out on whether or not the current coaches can correct the gaping holes on defense

If these things happen, do you think the team will be good? Or is it simply impossible for any of these things to happen?
Not impossible. But some are not likely either. The Zags should be competitive in their remaining OOC games and remain contenders to hit the board ( WPS ) in the WCC regular season

MickMick
12-12-2010, 11:40 AM
If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

Elias can't be as good as last season with Matt out of the lineup. Matt made others around him better. Who is like that on the Zags?

If Marquise Carter adjusts from Juco to high level D1.

I have given up on Carter. WAZZU's Reggie Moore as a freshman demonstrated that it is less about adjustment and more about the skills, BB IQ, and mindset you bring with you. Big men take time to adjust, not guards. There are countless examples of guards contributing immediately without major adjustment.

If Olynyk and Dower take the bit between the teeth and start playing tough.

Their version of tough is drawing fouls. It makes them tentative to be tough as once they draw a foul, they back off on the tough part. They will be tough once they learn the technique of defending without fouling. KO gets beat with his feet so much, that I think he will always be a "fouler". I'm still on the Dower bandwagon. Big men do need time to adjust. He brings scoring ability and I don't believe he has scratched the surface on what he can do.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

Arop is the true bright spot on the team. Put next year's class with him and he can really shine. Manny has star power. You can live with his mistakes because of the good things he brings to the table.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

Comments previously made about Arop apply here as well. Put him with a guy that makes his teammates better (like Matt was or Pangos will be) and MM will thrive.

If the offense starts clicking and the defense starts gelling and the attitude turns to take-no-prisoners.

I don't see it happening enough to make a difference. Zags will get better. So will everyone else. They aren't going to get better at a greater rate than anyone else. One could argue that the WAZZU game was regression.

If these things happen, do you think the team will be good? Or is it simply impossible for any of these things to happen?

Some of these things will happen. All of them won't.

rijman
12-12-2010, 11:45 AM
I believe we will see the benefits of having an experienced and very successful coaching staff. I believe Few will find a way to get the most out of this team. What do I base that assumption on? His track record.

This Zags team has started slow and is struggling, but it's not how you start the season that matters most, it's how you finish it. If Few can guide this team to a conference title and tourney win they can head into the NCAA tourney on a high note. I believe this Zags team has not played their best ball, which means I believe their best is yet to come.

ZagLawGrad
12-12-2010, 11:47 AM
I believe we will see the benefits of having an experienced and very successful coaching staff. I believe Few will find a way to get the most out of this team. What do I base that assumption on? His track record.

This Zags team has started slow and is struggling, but it's not how you start the season that matters most, it's how you finish it. If Few can guide this team to a conference title and tourney win they can head into the NCAA tourney on a high note. I believe this Zags team has not played their best ball, which means I believe their best is yet to come.

I agree that Few will get the most out of this team. But then again, he's not a magician.

CDC84
12-12-2010, 12:00 PM
I felt Marquise made major strides in last night's game if you consider that he had hardly played up to that point. It was his best game as a Zag. Unlike other games that he played in, he actually brought the ball up the floor and the whole works instead of just standing out there. It took some pressure off of Steven Gray.

Is Carter ever going to be Kyrie Irving? No.

Jucos, for the most part, don't start to really "get it" until the end of their junior year, and really their senior year. There are exceptions, but Carter isn't an exception. Not ready to give up on him yet. But then again, I always had reasonable expections for him. I'd like to get his shooting going, because he is capable of being a 36-38% 3 point shooter. He just hasn't had many opportunities so far.

Monninghoff loves the corners, doesn't he? Has he missed all year with a corner 3? He struggles to make them from other areas of the court.

ZagLawGrad
12-12-2010, 12:03 PM
I felt Marquise made major strides in last night's game if you consider that he had hardly played up to that point. It was his best game as a Zag. Unlike other games that he played in, he actually brought the ball up the floor and the whole works instead of just standing out there. It took some pressure off of Steven Gray.

Is Carter ever going to be Kyrie Irving? No.

Jucos, for the most part, don't start to really "get it" until the end of their junior year, and really their senior year. There are exceptions, but Carter isn't an exception. Not ready to give up on him yet. But then again, I always had reasonable expections for him. I'd like to get his shooting going, because he is capable of being a 36-38% 3 point shooter. He just hasn't had too many opportunities so far.

Monninghoff loves the corners, doesn't he? Has he missed all year with a corner 3? He struggles to make them from other areas of the court.

Carter was at least coherent compared to prior games, I'll give him that. But major strides? Maybe some baby steps.

CDC84
12-12-2010, 12:37 PM
Carter was at least coherent compared to prior games, I'll give him that. But major strides? Maybe some baby steps.

i would still say he made major strides compared to the previous games he played in. I'll stand by that. I was comfortable with his play last night. First time I didn't have my hands gripping the arms on my chair when he had the ball in his hands.

ZagLawGrad
12-12-2010, 12:48 PM
i would still say he made major strides compared to the previous games he played in. I'll stand by that. I was comfortable with his play last night. First time I didn't have my hands gripping the arms on my chair when he had the ball in his hands.

LOL, I can relate. :)

VinnyZag
12-12-2010, 01:32 PM
I don't even think they need all of those things to happen. Mostly they need Harris to be the player he was last year, Arop to continue to play with confidence, and they need to improve defensively. Those things all seem possible to me.

But my expectations of this year have obviously changed. Before the season I thought this was a Sweet Sixteen or better group. Now I'd be happy if they make the tournament.

BobZag
12-12-2010, 01:51 PM
What if just these three things happen?

-------------------------------

If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

RenoZag
12-12-2010, 02:09 PM
This team would be a whole lot better if they could just pass the ball...

Catching it wouldn't be a bad idea either. . .

VinnyZag
12-12-2010, 02:09 PM
What if just these three things happen?

-------------------------------

If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

It's possible I'm being overly optimistic, but if those things happen I think GU wins 12 or 13 WCC games and becomes the 12 seed that nobody wants to play in the tournament.

Then again, I think the Seahawks are going to come back to beat the 49ers. So take my thoughts with a grain of salt.

btzag
12-12-2010, 02:16 PM
BZ you are right on with your point...this team is real close and if they can get some positive things to go their way you are going to see these close losses turn into wins.

4 positives would do this...and these can easily be reached

1) Harris continues to get healthy, works into shape and becomes a force once again who can play at that level for 35 mins a game.

2) Carter emerges as primary backup and gives the Zags two PG's who might not be elite but can hang with other teams PGs.

3) Arop consistently performs like he did against ND. We all know he has it in him and Few is really trying to push him to draw it out consistently. He benched him early in the season and rides him hard still but you can see that his idea is for Arop to take that position by the horns and excel.

4) Dower and Monninghoff emerge as great bench players who come in and provide a 5-10 minute boost. Monninghoff as a long range sniper who has length on D and can RB and Dower as an active forward who can board on both ends and be a back to the basket scorer.


All of these are right there and happening in front of our eyes. This team could easily go 7-1 over the remaining non-conf schedule and if we get momentum watch out.

Another quick point...I've seen the top WCC teams (GU, SMC, UP) play multiple times this year and GU should still be considered the favorite. Even the 'bad' Zags from earlier this year would be a favorite on any betting line and if the above improvements can occur, watch out!

WeSayZed
12-12-2010, 02:19 PM
If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

If Marquise Carter adjusts from Juco to high level D1.

If Olynyk and Dower take the bit between the teeth and start playing tough.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

If the offense starts clicking and the defense starts gelling and the attitude turns to take-no-prisoners.

If these things happen, do you think the team will be good? Or is it simply impossible for any of these things to happen?
We don’t need all of that to happen. Getting Harris healthy would be all we’d need to become a good team again, but most of these things are highly likely to happen.

Harris’ injury is healing and he is returning to form. We’ve seen that happening.

Juco players do adjust, and we can see that happening as well. I think it was Ehlo who said that it can take half a season, and we’re not there yet.

Olynyk looks to me like he’s still getting used to his new body, and Dower, despite being the most massively overhyped player since ... Demetri Goodson last year, isn’t that important to us this year. He’ll be important next year, however, so we do need to give him some minutes to help him develop.

Arop will be important to us this year, and he is also not only getting back into the groove but showing signs of improvement from last year. Most young players develop and, as expected, Manny is developing. It’s just happening a couple of months later than we would have liked. I wonder if his injury from last year held him back somehow?

With Arop coming around Monninghoff doesn’t need to be a major contributor this year, but like Dower we need to bring him along for next year.

ZagLawGrad
12-12-2010, 02:23 PM
...then again, i think the seahawks are going to come back to beat the 49ers. So take my thoughts with a grain of salt.

lol :)

MDABE80
12-12-2010, 02:39 PM
First off...good to see you posting again BZ.

If we had a PG who was very good, we'd be in the E8 or further. If it was me, I'd make a Meech masque and put in on Gary Bell for weekend games.
1. All I'd like is Elias being superior again...and return.
2. MM and Manny turned lose like last night. I'm beginning to think that the more Manny plays, the better he gets.
3. We need Dower on those boards and his sweet stroke. KO's not up for that..he's too ..something...not sure what it is. More time to grow into his body and a more feisty brain.

Now if the rest of the guys get better by 10%, we're in and we go far.

bigblahla
12-12-2010, 04:05 PM
This team would be a whole lot better if they could just pass the ball...

From the looks of it I'd bet a dollar against a donut they don't spend 15 minutes a practice on just passing.

Hope I'm wrong.

Go!! Zags!!!

BobZag
12-12-2010, 04:17 PM
Glazed or cake donuts? :) Me love donuts.

MDABE80
12-12-2010, 04:22 PM
Ummmmmm...so does the Hondomeister the Great!;)

jazzdelmar
12-12-2010, 04:27 PM
heres a bigger what if, bz: what if next years newcomers arent demonstrably better than those of the past couple of years? what if, and what then?

sonuvazag
12-12-2010, 04:46 PM
no sign any will happen for sure
There never is.

I think it helps to realize things can get better and they could also get worse. That's about as realistic as you need to be.

duper
12-12-2010, 05:07 PM
The problem is all those "ifs" were there at the start of the season, we just assumed all the "ifs" would work out for the positive and that hasn't happened.

I see this team winning the WCC tourney and making the DANCE. If I was a coach of a 1,2,or 3 seed I would hate to draw this GU team in March.

madness
12-12-2010, 05:42 PM
I think the best mix of talent and effort so far is: (as a lineup)

Gray
Arop
Hoff
Harris
Sacre

The major question marks there are:

1. Harris conditioning
2. Hoff Defense (particularly in the zone)
3. Arop ball handling

So, with each day, Harris will lose his baby fat, someone tell him to stop eating at Sonic! Arop and Hoff can be coached up heavily, and bam! We have a crunchtime lineup.

Now, if Carter/Meech are needed defensively against a quick guard, insert...but I truly don't think either will give the team what it needs with this mix of talent this year. Meech could really score if he just tried Pargo's drive, drop step and pop play, not sure why he can't diversify after 3 years.

That lineup will be very hard to match up with, and should be able to play a very good 2-3 zone defense with length on the wings. I believe that this team needs to actively switch defense during the game, because Sacre and Harris hedging is horrible and any big man that can shoot will kill us.

madness
12-12-2010, 05:43 PM
Aside, I need the Zags to turn it around. Every other team I follow is horrible and getting worse. I have a serious investment in this team. I'm going to be home for the Xavier game, and would love to see a win!

MDABE80
12-12-2010, 06:31 PM
Well the nice thing about the "what ifs" BZ describes are the things fixable for the team. Each one can be fixed. Most will be. It's hard to isolate those things.

Anyway, staff fixes those things it can and ELias heals, it'll be a long road back but I do think we'll be in the tournement for a few weekends. This CAN be a bigtime team. I do hope those fixes are easy.
I'd get Gray, MM, Manny, Rob and Eli on the same page and go with the bigger lineup who can shoot. Defense is what wins games but this team doesn't seem to be aware of it.

SO go with the guns who put points up. Meech in the waiting for ball handling if it's a touch chore in any given game.

montanazag88
12-12-2010, 10:11 PM
What if just these three things happen?

-------------------------------

If Elias Harris heals and returns to the same Elias Harris, or better, of last season.

If Mangisto steps up and plays every game like he did vs Notre Dame.

If Monninghoff gets more touches, keeps shooting it well, and adds a wrinkle or two to his arsenal, ie, driving, mid-range, etc.

What say you, BZ?

U Zig, I Zag
12-13-2010, 06:51 AM
It's just simply too optimisitic to believe all of these will happen with this team, some will, some will not. Notwithstanding some good OOC games to come, I think we are off the national radar for the remainder of the season. Our only salvation for this season is to keep our tournament string alive. As others have pointed out, if you can get in the tournament (even as a 10/12 seed), anything can happen.

I agree.

Keep improving, game by game, day by day and get into that tournament. No b#tching about seeding, etc. Just get on a plane and go play. Get a 12 or 13 seed. Who cares. Guarantee you that GU would be a pretty feared 12 or 13 seed.

I am putting this all on the WCC conf tourney. Our only way in is through that door (there is no way we win out and then lose in the WCC tourney game - not a chance in hell).

BobZag
12-13-2010, 09:10 AM
heres a bigger what if, bz: what if next years newcomers arent demonstrably better than those of the past couple of years? what if, and what then?

Dooooooooomed.

But what if Few quits, Tommy moves to Belize, Giacoletti takes the EWU job again and Donny Daniels runs off with Halle Berry?

RenoZag
12-13-2010, 10:53 AM
Dooooooooomed.

But what if Few quits, Tommy moves to Belize, Giacoletti takes the EWU job again and Donny Daniels runs off with Halle Berry?

Most if not all of the people who view this board will continue to follow Gonzaga basketball.

The remainder will be insanely jealous of Coach Daniels. . .

GorgeZag
12-13-2010, 04:52 PM
All of those things could happen and they STILL wouldn't be able to gaurd the 3ball. This is what, year 9 now of not being able to?

Reborn
12-13-2010, 05:42 PM
Every team in Div 1 could say the same that Bob is, and all 350 teams would be tied to get into the tournament. Ha ha ha haha. I don't like the "what if's" kind of thinking.

I think what won't happen this year is that Kelly Olynyk will not get up to speed with is footwork. He is clumsy and slow and kills us on defense especially. If Few continues to give him minutes over Dower then this will hurt the team. Dower needs to play more than Olynyk.

I do not see Meech imporoving on his shot. It was said that he had improved last summer, but this improvement has not transfered into more confidence on the floor during real games and in particular against the better teams.

The Zags will not get better at defending the 3 pt shot. As has been stated, they never have been able to defend it.


I think what the answer is for this team is more offense, and I think we can get that as we begin to gel, and Harris gets back into game shape. As we have seen, Manny Arop has some talent and I am just hoping that Few finally begins to recognize it and let's Manny just be Manny. The Zags do have 4 guys who can score in double figures, and that, folks, is just about as good as it gets. These four guys will get more and more cohesive as they head toward March. I saw more cohesion against Notre Dame then I've seen all this year. Few needs to get back to playing Zag basketball, which as I remember means getting the ball up court quickly and playing at a faster pace. When the team plays Zagball, we look way better on offense.

Gonzaga has shown that it can shoot the 3 ball. Saturday was the 3rd game this year that the Zags made more than 10 three's. The 3 ball needs to be emphasized more, and obviously the answer is Arop, Gray and Monninghoff. So let's just recognize that we need 3 pointers and create an offense that develops those shots. All that it takes to do that is passing the ball, moving it quickly and hitting the open shots. It means driving the lane and kicking out to shooters. It means passing the ball in an area where defenders can catch it and shoot it quickly. I think the 20 assists in Saturday's game was significant. Good passing has to be mandated. Its a must.

Gonzaga is a team that needs to score 80 points a game, or very near it. Gonzaga has never been a team that wins when they score in the 60's. In order to do this we need to begin to get some consistent scoring from some guys that we are not getting it from now. For me, at the top of this list are Carter and Monninghoff, and to some extent Meech. Monninghoff and Meech have been very inconsistent and therefore unpredictable, and that is not good for the team. We don't need lots of points from these guys, and Carter and Meech need to score 12 points between them consistently, and I think 14 is a better bench mark. These two guys need to wake up and begin to get some dang confidence. I am sick and tired of watching this lack of confidence game after game after game. Carter was a dang good player last year, and he really needs to get inside of himself and have a good talk with himself. Or maybe his dad needs to call him. Carter needs to wake up and smell the roses. The one IF that I believe is important is WHAT IF CARTER begins to play like we thought he could.....I think he is like Arop. He has the talent and just needs to find it through believing in himself.

Go Zags!!!

Kiddwell
12-13-2010, 08:45 PM
I think what won't happen this year is that Kelly Olynyk will not get up to speed with is footwork. He is clumsy and slow and kills us on defense especially. If Few continues to give him minutes over Dower then this will hurt the team. Dower needs to play more than Olynyk.
Go Zags!!!

What if KO developed a back-to-the-basket presence? He's got the height, is gaining the muscle, and has (IMO) better hands and moves than Big Rob. As a former guard, Kelly seems to have a decent knack for passing out of trouble too, which is something Rob did better at in the last game, by the way.

The Canadian national team had high praise for Kelly. How'd they use him?

So move KO inside (aka back-to-the-basket), eh?

:]

GeorgiaZagFan
12-14-2010, 03:26 AM
The Zags have the same problems the Tarheels had last year.....all the talent in the world...except at the most critical position....point guard!!!

Gonzaga will not be able to compete at a higher level when they have a point guard who consistently goes almost no points and a just a few assists while playing 25 minutes a game!!

WSU completely jammed up the offense by playing way off Goodson...and he never even shot the ball!! If he can't knock down a wide open three with no one guarding him at least 35% of the time...he's a liability...or he needs to be really running the offense and getting 8 assists a game and making plays that are leading to others getting assists.....

Reborn
12-14-2010, 07:44 AM
The Zags have the same problems the Tarheels had last year.....all the talent in the world...except at the most critical position....point guard!!!

Gonzaga will not be able to compete at a higher level when they have a point guard who consistently goes almost no points and a just a few assists while playing 25 minutes a game!!

WSU completely jammed up the offense by playing way off Goodson...and he never even shot the ball!! If he can't knock down a wide open three with no one guarding him at least 35% of the time...he's a liability...or he needs to be really running the offense and getting 8 assists a game and making plays that are leading to others getting assists.....

And Carter has been just as bad. Carter is a good penetrator but terrible finisher. Why doesnt he do two things? One. After penetrating, why doesnt he kick out to open shooters from the 3 pt line. 2. Why doens't he drive all the way in to the rim and try to draw a foul. He seems afraid to take it to the rim and fades away and tries to AVOID contact. Now if he's afraid to play the game, then isn't the place for him on the bench? I don't think Stockton is afraid, and he's not even on scholarship.

Martin Centre Mad Man
12-14-2010, 08:17 AM
The Zags will not get better at defending the 3 pt shot. As has been stated, they never have been able to defend it.

I actually disagree. Their three-point defense has been terrible for most of this season, but I don't think that it cannot be improved with coaching, practice, and just getting an injured player healthy.

I was start by saying that I have only watched three games: Illinois, KSU, and Notre Dame. Those were all teams that destroyed the Zags from three point range.

The one positive that I saw in those games was the defense of the starting backcourt. Meech and Gray are not getting beaten. Most teams' best three-point shooters are the starting guards and Gray and Meech seem to be containing them one on one. That can't be coached. Either your guards are quick enough and athletic enough to stay in front of the opposing guards or they can't. Ours can do it. Arop gives us a third guard/wing with the quickness to take an opposing player out of the offense for long stretches of games, although he has not been as consistent as Gray and Meech as I will discuss below.

Most of the defensive break-downs occur on switches and when opposing forwards/wings move out to the perimeter and our forwards fail to follow them. That can be coached and will get better as the players continue to play together and learn their assignments and learn how to better communicate on the floor. Arop, and Monninghoff have been particularly bad about losing their assignments, but Harris, K.O., Dower, and even Sacre have all had lapses where they either lost their man or didn't get out to the perimeter fast enough. In Harris's case, he's looked slow on both sides of the court, so I'm not surprised that he hasn't been able to get to the perimeter as quickly as he should. I think he will improve as he gets healthy. With the other players, it should be noted that most of them are young and haven't had a lot of experience.

I don't think this is ever going to be a great defensive team, but I think that it can and will be a lot better by the end of the season. If the players were just too slow to guard opposing guards and wings, I'd actually be more worried. They're athletic enough to play better defense. They just need to learn how to do it.

BobZag
12-14-2010, 09:47 AM
Every team in Div 1 could say the same that Bob is, and all 350 teams would be tied to get into the tournament. Ha ha ha haha. I don't like the "what if's" kind of thinking.

I think what won't happen this year is that Kelly Olynyk will not get up to speed with is footwork. He is clumsy and slow and kills us on defense especially. If Few continues to give him minutes over Dower then this will hurt the team. Dower needs to play more than Olynyk.

I do not see Meech imporoving on his shot. It was said that he had improved last summer, but this improvement has not transfered into more confidence on the floor during real games and in particular against the better teams.

The Zags will not get better at defending the 3 pt shot. As has been stated, they never have been able to defend it.


I think what the answer is for this team is more offense, and I think we can get that as we begin to gel, and Harris gets back into game shape. As we have seen, Manny Arop has some talent and I am just hoping that Few finally begins to recognize it and let's Manny just be Manny. The Zags do have 4 guys who can score in double figures, and that, folks, is just about as good as it gets. These four guys will get more and more cohesive as they head toward March. I saw more cohesion against Notre Dame then I've seen all this year. Few needs to get back to playing Zag basketball, which as I remember means getting the ball up court quickly and playing at a faster pace. When the team plays Zagball, we look way better on offense.

Gonzaga has shown that it can shoot the 3 ball. Saturday was the 3rd game this year that the Zags made more than 10 three's. The 3 ball needs to be emphasized more, and obviously the answer is Arop, Gray and Monninghoff. So let's just recognize that we need 3 pointers and create an offense that develops those shots. All that it takes to do that is passing the ball, moving it quickly and hitting the open shots. It means driving the lane and kicking out to shooters. It means passing the ball in an area where defenders can catch it and shoot it quickly. I think the 20 assists in Saturday's game was significant. Good passing has to be mandated. Its a must.

Gonzaga is a team that needs to score 80 points a game, or very near it. Gonzaga has never been a team that wins when they score in the 60's. In order to do this we need to begin to get some consistent scoring from some guys that we are not getting it from now. For me, at the top of this list are Carter and Monninghoff, and to some extent Meech. Monninghoff and Meech have been very inconsistent and therefore unpredictable, and that is not good for the team. We don't need lots of points from these guys, and Carter and Meech need to score 12 points between them consistently, and I think 14 is a better bench mark. These two guys need to wake up and begin to get some dang confidence. I am sick and tired of watching this lack of confidence game after game after game. Carter was a dang good player last year, and he really needs to get inside of himself and have a good talk with himself. Or maybe his dad needs to call him. Carter needs to wake up and smell the roses. The one IF that I believe is important is WHAT IF CARTER begins to play like we thought he could.....I think he is like Arop. He has the talent and just needs to find it through believing in himself.

Go Zags!!!

If you don't like "what if" threads, jeepers creepers, don't feel obliged to write a book in it while bashing players, man. Ha ha ha haha.

DZ
12-14-2010, 11:05 AM
Good reply. BZ.

I believe in what ifs. . . I thought we would play better against ND and had we shot the ball a little better and guarded the three a little better we would have won. I do admit that ND was not playing their "A" game either.

I don't know if LC even counts on their record but they sure need it to count if they can play cohesively. I have noted (to myself anyway. . no one comments on mine) that this team is wound way too tight and is afraid, every game expecting the worst to happen. Matt Bouldin was crucial in the fact that in many games (not all, see blowouts, SU, NC, etc) he kept hope alive with timely threes or impossible drives.

Early in the year, SDSU specifically, Gray was not afraid and played like an All American. Now, I think the lack of confidence has rubbed off on him, and why wouldn't it, the bigs cannot catch, he has to work hard to even get a hand off from our PG and he has 3 people on him if he drives. He could kick a drive or pass underneath, but to whom? None of them want it. I don't think it would take all the things BZ listed to turn the team around, play to their potential I mean.

I think it takes one or two games of seeing the ball fall threw nets, consistently - and that is NOT going to happen when everyone is terrified, knowing they are going to miss. It seems like Manny has the green light now - look what is happening, he is turning back into the scorer he was for Canada.

I have no idea what is wrong with KO. I know he has no confidence and that has to come from within.

Sacre is getting better, not that this board would note it. He played really well against ND and should be our No. 1 option on offense and that should open up things for Harris/Steven.

Even if we had an elite PG (and next years ARE elite), this team would still be struggling due to confidence. Play PG by committee, Meech, Carter, Stock, even Hart. Find someone confident that day and ride him.

As for Harris, he is playing better, but I do not judge Harris' health by him hitting jump shots. When he starts jamming offensive rebounds over three people - then I will know he is healthy - and it may not happen this year.

I think we will pick up a couple of wins against Baylor, Xavier, OK St. Wake, Memphis, do that and finish first or tied in WCC regular season, win the tournament and be an 11 seed. Win two games, call it a great year. Steven deserves as much. He has been a wonderful player, and all we could ask for off the court.

DZ
12-14-2010, 11:10 AM
I forgot to add that we need to start turning other teams over. At the beginning of the year, we didn't rebound well, - - we fixed that pretty well, but it has been a long time since I have seen us get easy points through lay-ups and dunks from turn overs - - I point again to confidence, we don't know when to take a risk, and then we make a dumb pass or none at all and have no fast break points.

I am sure that the lack of fast break points is in red in the coaching stats, THAT is an "if" that certainly can be fixed. Just need some confidence and swagger.

BobZag
12-14-2010, 02:00 PM
Good posts, Dixie. Agree with most of what you say. I did like the improvement in the ND game, but I like losing about as much as I like brussel sprouts. Zags did shoot over 50%. Lapses in D and fouls were costly there.

We saw Harris going to the rim for putback jams vs Illinois, so I'm going to surmise that he does not yet fully trust his achilles heel and, thus, is off and on, plus he could lose 5-10 pounds while regaining his stamina. He is gassed in 2nd-halfs.

Winning heals a ton of problems, including confidence issues. Teams like Baylor make that a tough assignment, but the wins should start coming soon. I say "should" because nobody can be sure.

I'm very encouraged that Few is going to be much more involved with recruiting now, starting with the 2011 class. Less whiffs, more homeruns. I'll welcome that.

LC State won't count in any important W/L record, but due to Finals the guys have not practiced Monday and Tuesday. The game Thursday will be all about the basics and working off the cobwebs.

Reborn
12-15-2010, 12:38 AM
If you don't like "what if" threads, jeepers creepers, don't feel obliged to write a book in it while bashing players, man. Ha ha ha haha.

Sorry BZ. I didn't know that we had to agree with everything you think in order to write on your threads. I'll be more careful next time I think about writing on your threads. I also didn't know that being honest and sharing our opinions was called bashing. :lmao:

ZagLawGrad
12-15-2010, 06:56 AM
I'm sure Reborn has some interesting things to say, but with all due respect, can you boil it down significantly, please? I skip most anything over 5 or 6 sentences, which means I don't read most of your posts. Nothing personal, but many of us from the non-computer age find it tedious to read long posts off the computer screen. Just a suggestion, thanks! :)

cjm720
12-15-2010, 07:33 AM
BZ, can you elaborate on Few being more involved in recruiting? We know he went hard after Goodson and Bell personally...

Did he say this in an interview or is it what you are hearing?

Go Zags!!!!!!