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View Full Version : Break through game for RS



gamagin
12-04-2010, 04:33 PM
strong return for EH.

Meech put in a blue collar day.

SG had a bad day.

Manny and SD represented.

KO improved a little.

MM & Marquise got some p.t. and are still getting over the shock of the level of play they face.

Overall,we looked better. We did great in the first half under the basket, especially on offense. and we had our chances but didn't capitalize.

We lost to a Number five ranked team and they had to shoot threes like they've never shot before to put it away. So they did.

No shame, imo, in this game. Lots of improvement showing. More needed and more to come.

Heads up, fans. There was no shame in this loss.

drnoe
12-04-2010, 04:43 PM
Lost to a largely perimeter team that got really hot today. Frustrating game to watch. The Zags should have scored a lot more in the paint. The WSU game is going to be really tough.

TacomaZAG
12-04-2010, 06:06 PM
15 and 10 against a good Illini front line. That little baby hook with the left hand was a thing of beauty, first time I've seen that from him. Keep it up big guy.

Other observations from the 4th row:

1. We can't defend the three again this year. Between 1:16 to go in the first half and 11:11 to go in the game, the Illini were 10 of 12 from behind the arc, most of them wide open looks. Against a Top 25 team, that spells defeat, everytime.

2. Stockton is over-matched physically against Top 25 teams. Maybe he won't be in a year or two, but he definitely is now.

3. Without another perimeter scorer, or without Elias in the game, Gray is going to get swarmed by 2 or 3 defenders every time he touches the ball. He didn't have a bad game today, he had no chance to have a good game due to no other Zag perimeter threat.

4. I will NEVER, ever critisize Meech again. When he picked up the two early fouls and had to sit, our offense suffered horribly.

5. We are not a Top 25 team right now, hopefully we will continue to improve through the rest of the season, but we are not anywhere near there right now.

On to Wazzu........

Go ZAGS

ZagLawGrad
12-04-2010, 06:25 PM
RS played better, but not sure about a breakout game.

BigTymeONIONS
12-04-2010, 06:32 PM
15 and 10 is not a break out game for a guy who has done that repeatedly in his career. And the frontline for Illinois is skinny and weak. Rob had a good game, as he should have. Rob has been our most consistent player all season, imo. Everyone else is up and down, you never know what you'll get.

allbusiness_zag
12-04-2010, 08:46 PM
4. I will NEVER, ever critisize Meech again. When he picked up the two early fouls and had to sit, our offense suffered horribly.


Thank you. I think people realized today how much we need Meech when he got in foul trouble. Meech had a great day I hope his hand is alright.

MickMick
12-04-2010, 09:19 PM
Thank you. I think people realized today how much we need Meech when he got in foul trouble. Meech had a great day I hope his hand is alright.

I was past the "blame Meech" phase after Kansas City.....kind of. You might think I'm crazy for saying this, but I think he is playing better than all but a couple of other players on the team.

He is definately better than last year. One minor problem I have with him is driving into trouble and trying to pass out of traps. But I can't really fault him for trying to make things happen and he doesn't do it nearly as often as before. Yet he still does it a couple times a game. Not enough to really get upset about.

His bounce pass to Manny was what I would like to see from him more often. Very nice pass. The problem is that you need movement from other players to make it happen and when they do move, Meech needs to recognize and pull the trigger a little more often. He is getting there in the passing department.

My biggest single problem with Meech at the moment? He isn't shooting nearly enough. With his quickness, he should easily be able to separate and shoot. He has the physical skills to create his own shot. But more puzzling is his reluctance to take open shots. He isn't past the "open look" phase enough to even begin to think about consistently creating shots.

But when he does create he looks good doing it. Those few times he does get quickly to an opening and fires, he looks like a nice weapon.

Whenever a defender gets beat with his feet, he inherently tries to compensate with his hands. Meech should be shooting 8-10 foul shots a game with his physical tools.

C'mon Meech. Let a few more shots fly. It can't end up any worse than what we saw the rest of the team doing. When this team gets into the "we got nothing to lose" phase, I hope to see Meech more assertive (read daring) with both his passing and shooting. He just has to relax and let it all hang out.

fedwayzag
12-04-2010, 09:20 PM
From my seat in the nose bleed section they did not play to bad. Came down to a couple of things. First of all we let Illinois get into their offense on every possession. It is typical of GU. We really get up in passing lanes and deny the first entry pass on the the other teams offense. On the other hand Ill was denying the first pass and then we looked like we did not know what to do. We actually looked lost!! B-ball is a game of action and re-action. Right now the team is "running" the play and when it breaks down we have a difficult time scoring. the team needs to be let loose on offense. GU offense is fairly predictable. Predictable = easy to stop/frustrate.

gamagin
12-04-2010, 10:15 PM
This is the kind of game where you look at the stats and the team didn't seem to be doing too badly--especially if you just look at the rebounding stats where we controlled the boards, 35-24. But collectively, this team just stunk. Slow rotations on defense (not measured by any statistic), no cohesion on offense. After a couple belabored passes this team just seems to run out of ideas(also not measured by any stats). Oh yes, one stat comes to mind---zero steals. The lethargy has set in. Might not see another win until the Lewis and Clark game.

I think your theory is the antithesis of those who rely on stats too much. I try to see what's going on and believe most of the time the stats back this up.

I didn't know and don't care how many boards RS got tonight. I just watched and n oticed he was getting good boards, beating his opponents, not easy unchallenged ones. He was (mostly) holding the ball high and putting back the way he should. He was shooting with his left and right and he was genuinely dominating his post & his opponent underneath for most of the time he was in.

Afterwards, I posit, the stats, to those who rely on them, backed that up. If the stats didn't, I would stil contend RS's boards and general play underneath was perhaps his best of the year.

Unfortunately (there is always that BUT thing) his opponent turned out to be a dead eye from the trey. whoda thunk that ?

This is different, imo, than the breakdown atop the key. For whatever reasons, it broke down too often. I think it was the fact that our hot hand, SG, went cold. I don't think it was all about a superior or dominant opponent. SG can and has shot against them all. He passed up alot of shots. They all did. That, to me, is why the "plays" broke down over and over. Our shooter wouldn't shoot and the others wouldn't either. No one took charge.

So it's back to work. But credit where it's due, imo. RS & Eh played well. Meech did, too.

We just need the whole team on the ball and in the game all at the same time.

allbusiness_zag
12-04-2010, 11:30 PM
I was past the "blame Meech" phase after Kansas City.....kind of. You might think I'm crazy for saying this, but I think he is playing better than all but a couple of other players on the team.

He is definately better than last year. One minor problem I have with him is driving into trouble and trying to pass out of traps. But I can't really fault him for trying to make things happen and he doesn't do it nearly as often as before. Yet he still does it a couple times a game. Not enough to really get upset about.

His bounce pass to Manny was what I would like to see from him more often. Very nice pass. The problem is that you need movement from other players to make it happen and when they do move, Meech needs to recognize and pull the trigger a little more often. He is getting there in the passing department.

My biggest single problem with Meech at the moment? He isn't shooting nearly enough. With his quickness, he should easily be able to separate and shoot. He has the physical skills to create his own shot. But more puzzling is his reluctance to take open shots. He isn't past the "open look" phase enough to even begin to think about consistently creating shots.

But when he does create he looks good doing it. Those few times he does get quickly to an opening and fires, he looks like a nice weapon.

Whenever a defender gets beat with his feet, he inherently tries to compensate with his hands. Meech should be shooting 8-10 foul shots a game with his physical tools.

C'mon Meech. Let a few more shots fly. It can't end up any worse than what we saw the rest of the team doing. When this team gets into the "we got nothing to lose" phase, I hope to see Meech more assertive (read daring) with both his passing and shooting. He just has to relax and let it all hang out.

Completely agree. Great post MickMick.

CaliforniaZaggin'
12-04-2010, 11:39 PM
C'mon Meech. Let a few more shots fly.

Cheers to that. Get square, set your feet, and knock it down. If teams have to play him honest, then we'll have a lot easier time scoring points.

MickMick
12-05-2010, 12:47 AM
Cheers to that. Get square, set your feet, and knock it down. If teams have to play him honest, then we'll have a lot easier time scoring points.

He is quick enough to get all of that done faster than the time it takes to read what you wrote.

The Zags owned the boards against Illinois. Rob, Elias, KO, and Sam should be playing volleyball next to the rim. It isn't the end of the world for Meech to miss a couple of open looks.

It will take pressure off Steven and open up some passing.

But this is less about Meech being a spot shooter and more about being a creator. I would like to see him drive quickly (like he commonly does), but pull up and shoot instead of stopping to seek out Steven. I believe he is much more effective doing that than awaiting a pass, setting up, and firing.

He is driving to far into the crowd. He just needs to drive into openings. Those 12 footers would be open all day if he just pulled up and shot.

He could be like that jackrabbit we saw from Wake Forest last year and what I just described is exactly what I saw that kid do.

TacomaZAG
12-05-2010, 07:50 AM
+1, great post.

There are so many team positives that will come from Meech shooting more. When a few perimeter jumpers start to fall, I think his confidence will too. Pull the trigger Demetri........

Go ZAGS

zag67
12-05-2010, 08:35 AM
MickMick great post. The team just needs to keep working and reconizing that standing does not create offense. They have to move and move to open areas. one or two players cannot make an offensive team.