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Angelo Roncalli
11-01-2010, 12:29 PM
AP Preseason All-America Team
By The Associated Press
Published: Monday, November 1, 2010 at 9:01 a.m.
Last Modified: Monday, November 1, 2010 at 9:01 a.m.
The Associated Press' 2010-11 preseason All-America team, with school, height, year and votes from a 65-member national media panel (key 2009-10 statistics in parentheses):

Kyle Singler, Duke, 6-8, senior, 62 votes (16.5 ppg, 7.7 rpg)

Jacob Pullen, Kansas State, 6-0, senior, 53 (19.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 82.2 ft pct, 1.8 steals)

Jimmer Fredette, BYU, 6-2, senior, 49 (22.1 ppg, 4.7 apg, 45.8 3-pt fg pct, 89.2 ft pct)

JaJuan Johnson, Purdue, 6-10, senior, 46 (15.5 ppg, 7.1 rpg, 50.7 fg pct, 2.1 blocks)

Harrison Barnes, North Carolina, 6-8, freshman, 17 (19.7 ppg, 8.8 rpg, 60 fg pct at Ames (Iowa) HS)

Others receiving votes (alphabetical): Jeff Allen, Virginia Tech; Malcolm Delaney, Virginia Tech; LaceDarius Dunn, Baylor; Austin Freeman, Georgetown; Elias Harris, Gonzaga.

John Henson, North Carolina; Kyrie Irving, Duke; Brandon Knight, Kentucky; Anthony Jones, Baylor; Kevin Jones, West Virginia.

Kalin Lucas, Michigan State; Jon Leuer, Wisconsin; Shelvin Mack, Butler; Demetri McCamey, Illinois; Marcus Morris, Kansas.

Mason Plumlee, Duke; Nolan Smith, Duke; Jared Sullinger, Ohio State; Durrell Summers, Michigan State; Isaiah Thomas, Washington; Trey Thompkins, Georgia; Kemba Walker, Connecticut.

U Zig, I Zag
11-01-2010, 12:35 PM
Obviously we got the whole year ahead of us to hash this out, but is someone like Isaiah Thomas better than Steven?

75Zag
11-01-2010, 12:52 PM
I have my WCC tickets and hotel reservations. I have a few early round NCAA tickets in hand and have made some strategic plans for other alternatives in the first and second rounds of the NCAA tournament. I have my eye on Stub-Hub late round ticket options and I buy everything possible on my airline miles credit card so I can make last minute March / April flights without breaking the bank.

I think it is time to sit back and forget about pre-season predictions of players and teams, and just see who wins the darn games.

Is anybody else sick and tired of recruiting and forecasts and predictions and whatever?

Just play the #$@%&*) game!

Go Bulldogs!

Nevtelen
11-01-2010, 01:20 PM
Obviously we got the whole year ahead of us to hash this out, but is someone like Isaiah Thomas better than Steven?

Gray is potentially better IMO because of his size and diverse skillset (i.e. 14 and 14 from the 2 guard vs a big Sw 16 team was pretty good IMO). However, with his inconsistency and, frankly, terrible 3 pt #s (which is supposed to be a strong part of his game), I have to say yes at this point. If Gray could put it all together and be consistent about it (i.e. play like he did in Maui the whole season), I think he has the potential to be the better player, but I just haven't seen it to date.

FlyZag
11-01-2010, 01:34 PM
Obviously we got the whole year ahead of us to hash this out, but is someone like Isaiah Thomas better than Steven?

almost even stats.

IT = 16.9 pts, 3.9 reb, 3.2 ast, 2.4 to, 73%ft, 32% 3pt, 1.32pps
SG = 13.6 pts, 4.0 reb, 2.9 ast, 2.2 to, 77% ft, 32% 3pt, 1.33 pps

They both have 1.3/1 asst to to ratio, similar 3pt, ft #'s and rebound numbers. However, IT gets the nod with a little over 3pts more per game.

GoZags
11-01-2010, 01:39 PM
I believe Thomas is either the favorite (or perhaps co-favorite) among the preseason picks to be the Pac 10 Player of the Year. As such, he certainly (my opinion) deserves to be on this list.
-----------------
Disclaimer: To any Internet Stalker who may (i.e. will most likely) misinterpret what I've written here.

The above post is in no way intended to diminish any of our brethren WCC Conference Members.

U Zig, I Zag
11-01-2010, 01:41 PM
almost even stats.

IT = 16.9 pts, 3.9 reb, 3.2 ast, 2.4 to, 73%ft, 32% 3pt, 1.32pps
SG = 13.6 pts, 4.0 reb, 2.9 ast, 2.2 to, 77% ft, 32% 3pt, 1.33 pps

They both have 1.3/1 asst to to ratio, similar 3pt, ft #'s and rebound numbers. However, IT gets the nod with a little over 3pts more per game.

I am really hoping that SG steps up this year. I think we see him and Elias going back and forth on leading in scoring.

I also agree that SG has a better build, better size and has more upside (IMO) because of that. I really wish the dagger 3's would come back though.

Last year was so odd at times, with Meech, Matt and Steven on the floor at the same time and Meech bringing it up only to hand it off to Matt to actually play floor general.

I really believe that Steven's shooting percentages are going to be directly related to how much work he has to do to fill in the gaps that Meech/Carter leave. If those two can tag team this PG thing it will push us over the top and SG can be set free to roam wild. It's his team now....

RenoZag
11-01-2010, 01:45 PM
I think it is time to sit back and forget about pre-season predictions of players and teams, and just see who wins the darn games.

Is anybody else sick and tired of recruiting and forecasts and predictions and whatever?

Just play the #$@%&*) game!

Go Bulldogs!


:clap: etc.

ridgebackzag
11-01-2010, 02:13 PM
A lot of unproven bias on that list.

John Henson - 5.7 PPG, 4.4 RPG, 1.6 BPG (Last Year)
Mason Plumlee - 3.7 PPG, 3.1 RPG, 0.9 BPG (Last Year)

Those stats are dismal at best, even if your are playing behind a role-playing Brian Zoubek (not exactly an All-American) or "playing out of position".

Not to mention the other plethora of names that have yet to play 1 second of college ball. I'm glad the preseason is almost over.

FlyZag
11-01-2010, 02:24 PM
How about Mickey McConnell of SMC.

13.8 pts, 2.4/1 asst/TO ratio, 50.8% FG, 51% 3ptFG (led the nation)

Except he plays in a mid major conference so he obviously isn't any good... [sarcasm]

TacomaZAG
11-01-2010, 03:12 PM
let's not forget the defensive half of the game. IMHO, when we add that to the almost identical offensive stats, we have a clear winner, and it isn't IT. I'm looking for Steven to get his stroke back this year, as his role as a scorer will be more clearly defined. It will be fun to watch.......

Go ZAGS

sittingon50
11-01-2010, 03:42 PM
I'm kinda' hoping that Manny starts pulling the defensive assignment on the perimeter so that Steven gets freed up a bit on offense.

dawgfather11
11-01-2010, 04:36 PM
Obviously we got the whole year ahead of us to hash this out, but is someone like Isaiah Thomas better than Steven?

without a doubt IT is better than gray

NEC26
11-01-2010, 04:40 PM
without a doubt IT is better than gray

Well there you have it debate over.

dawgfather11
11-01-2010, 04:44 PM
let's not forget the defensive half of the game. IMHO, when we add that to the almost identical offensive stats, we have a clear winner, and it isn't IT. I'm looking for Steven to get his stroke back this year, as his role as a scorer will be more clearly defined. It will be fun to watch.......

Go ZAGS

the winner isn't as clear as you think, IT is a very good defender in his own right. He definitely gets overlooked on our team due to having 2 of the best defenders in the country in Overton and Holiday on the floor with him, he has publicly stated his goal for the year is to be on the pac-10 all defensive team. This isn't taking anything away from gray, just sayign the difference between the 2 defensively isn't that big :)

SLOZag
11-01-2010, 05:14 PM
With facts and solid reasoning like this (:doh:), this thread ought to be closed right now.


the winner isn't as clear as you think, IT is a very good defender in his own right. He definitely gets overlooked on our team due to having 2 of the best defenders in the country in Overton and Holiday on the floor with him, he has publicly stated his goal for the year is to be on the pac-10 all defensive team. This isn't taking anything away from gray, just sayign the difference between the 2 defensively isn't that big :)

Nevtelen
11-01-2010, 05:25 PM
the winner isn't as clear as you think, IT is a very good defender in his own right. He definitely gets overlooked on our team due to having 2 of the best defenders in the country in Overton and Holiday on the floor with him, he has publicly stated his goal for the year is to be on the pac-10 all defensive team. This isn't taking anything away from gray, just sayign the difference between the 2 defensively isn't that big :)

But no matter how hard he plays, Gray always will have the advantage of size that IT just can't match. I watched about half of the Husky's games last season and even on good days defensively, Thomas had the limitation of his size. There are some guards that will simply be able to abuse him because they have superior size (yes, his athleticism and speed is pretty good, but if the opposing guard is taller and athletic he's in trouble). As much as Gray is pretty poor offensively sometimes (not that IT is gold every time out, because he certainly isn't, either), his defense is generally very consistently excellent. I'm not sure Thomas can say the same. Even if he does step it up, which is possible, we're not talking about what *could be* in this thread, we're talking about what *is*.

Even though their rebounding stats are similar, also, I'd say Gray is a superior rebounder overall. His stats reflect the (fairly) quality rebounding on GU's team last season. IT's rebounding stats were put up on a much weaker rebounding team with much weaker rebounders around him.

MDABE80
11-01-2010, 05:50 PM
the winner isn't as clear as you think, IT is a very good defender in his own right. He definitely gets overlooked on our team due to having 2 of the best defenders in the country in Overton and Holiday on the floor with him, he has publicly stated his goal for the year is to be on the pac-10 all defensive team. This isn't taking anything away from gray, just sayign the difference between the 2 defensively isn't that big :)

I like it that Steven is a foot taller;) Bring back his 3 pt accuracy and he's an easy AA:)

dawgfather11
11-01-2010, 06:40 PM
But no matter how hard he plays, Gray always will have the advantage of size that IT just can't match. I watched about half of the Husky's games last season and even on good days defensively, Thomas had the limitation of his size. There are some guards that will simply be able to abuse him because they have superior size (yes, his athleticism and speed is pretty good, but if the opposing guard is taller and athletic he's in trouble). As much as Gray is pretty poor offensively sometimes (not that IT is gold every time out, because he certainly isn't, either), his defense is generally very consistently excellent. I'm not sure Thomas can say the same. Even if he does step it up, which is possible, we're not talking about what *could be* in this thread, we're talking about what *is*.

Even though their rebounding stats are similar, also, I'd say Gray is a superior rebounder overall. His stats reflect the (fairly) quality rebounding on GU's team last season. IT's rebounding stats were put up on a much weaker rebounding team with much weaker rebounders around him.

Oh definitely gray's 9 inches definitely doesn't hurt him and I wasn't saying he's a bad defender, he's a pretty good defender. My point was just that IT isn't that bad himself.

As to the rebounding not sure I get your logic for a couple of reasons #1 UW averaged more rebounds than the zags last year so not sure how it was a weaker team (although it was just slightly) and #2 gray has 9 inches on him and still only managed the exact same amount of rebounds? That would make one think IT did a better job of rebounding no?

Ekrub
11-01-2010, 07:27 PM
Steven gray put up those stats against more quality teams.

UW hit its stride in the tourney, but overall played a cupcake schedule. I think Steven Gray is a better overall player.

In no way do I think IT is a slouch, though. I believes he deserves this recognition. I just think that Steven Gray deserves it too.

dawgfather11
11-01-2010, 08:34 PM
Steven gray put up those stats against more quality teams.

UW hit its stride in the tourney, but overall played a cupcake schedule. I think Steven Gray is a better overall player.

In no way do I think IT is a slouch, though. I believes he deserves this recognition. I just think that Steven Gray deserves it too.

hmm weird I wasn't actually able to find anything to back this up... looks like the only thing you were right about was UW hitting it's stride late.

SOS for sagarin
UW- 69
GU-102
SOS for Kenpom
Non conference
UW-40
GU-30
Overall
UW-52
GU-107

perhaps you were mistaken?

MDABE80
11-01-2010, 08:38 PM
I think EK was referring to the OOC schedule DF. In that regard, he's quite correct. Regards....