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Section 116
05-13-2007, 03:25 PM
Seattle U has announced it's plan for competing at the Div 1 level, both from a building and a scheduling standpoint. Obviously scheduling other Div 1 basketball schools in Washington figures heavily in the plan. The question is, of course, should GU offer to play Seattle U every year, and curtail the current philosophy, which frankly hurt us last season. Another in state rivalry could be good, but it would take a date away from a potential game with a BCS school. We already have one game a year at Key Arena and it sounds as if that would be the venue for any GU-SU match. Any thoughts out there.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/cbasketball/315445_seattleu12.html

MickMick
05-13-2007, 03:43 PM
Romar will certainly schedule the cupcake. As for Gonzaga...what a weird situation. The team that worked so hard to schedule the big teams might be accused of "ducking" a lesser foe if they decline the offer. How ironic.

The folks at Seattle U know that a game against any of the big 3 (WSU,UW,GU) would lend instant credibility to their efforts.

Rangerzag
05-13-2007, 04:00 PM
The way the OkieVegas Sonics tell it, there should be lots of open floor time available at the Key Arena.

Zagdawg
05-13-2007, 05:19 PM
I would be in favor of scheduling them as part of our pre-season (first warm-up non-counting games)--- they can come and visit Spokane once a year.

229SintoZag
05-13-2007, 08:45 PM
Never schedule them. They dropped out of D-1 27 years ago and thought it was a smart move. Turns out it wasn't so smart. Too bad.

The rest of the WCC has been competing at the D-1 level, offering scholarships, funding facilities, and investing in Division I athletics over the course of those 27 years while SU was pissing away its stellar heritage (they played for a freaking title against Kentucky!) to save a few bucks.

SU sees the payoff from that investment from the sidelines and wants a piece of the pie as well. They want to divide an 8-slice pie 9 ways. Sorry. Given that the WCC has and always will be about a 1.5 bid league of basketball-focused schools, there is no benefit to the rest of the conference in admitting them.

No dice, IMHO.

The WCC should NEVER admit them. Even if Pepperdine or some other WCC school bolts. Never admit SU. Let them petition the big sky for membership.

They have no place else to go. Let them languish as an independent. They can schedule Texas San Antonio and Gardner Webb.

maineblackbear
05-13-2007, 08:56 PM
well, i guess sinto229zag should stop being so shy and really say how they really feel....

i am of mixed feelings; taught at SU for three years and graduated from GU.

SU has about 15-20 years of building before they can even hope to compete with us so I am confused where all the hard feelings come from... in my heart I guess I feel that if we (GU) are really what we claim to be than we will do everything we can to display our Jesuit heart-- in other words, be open to scheduling SU and be open to beating them by 40.

Anyway, go SU-- and go GU....mbb

Angelo Roncalli
05-13-2007, 09:09 PM
If I hear one more bit of revisionist history attributing Seattle U's drop to NAIA (not to D-2, they recently upgraded to D-2) to amorphous "financial reasons," I'm going to hurl.

I can debunk that myth in two words: Jawann Oldham.


The reason SU dropped from NCAA scrutiny was because the NCAA was bearing down on the Chieftain program like a freight train. Money was indeed involved, but it was a surplus of money (in some pockets), not a lack of money in the program. Fr. Sullivan didn't want to fight a war he knew he couldn't win and he was generally ambivalent toward athletics (except of course, when it came to him riding on vintage America's Cup yachts with the Newport set).

Hogan was preaching the revisionist party line on KJR the other day. Somebody should have called him out.

The way this thing is getting spun is a little like a 1930's Judy Garland/Mickey Rooney musical..."hey gang, let's put on a show!!!" And suddenly an old barn houses a Broadway-type musical.

Callero and Hogan are delusional if they think they're going to snap their fingers and have GU, WSU and UW do their bidding and agree to home and homes. Seattle U will get its home and homes for the foreseeable future against the Big Sky, Big West and MAYBE some WCC teams, but not likely GU. Look for SU to schedule a number of big name opponents on the road in pay-for-play preseason games that will result in some healthy paychecks.

Zagster
05-13-2007, 09:53 PM
I think it is great that SU wants to go to D1. It will take 2 years to move to D1. Schedule them as a exibition for the next 2/3 years. Let them be an independent for several years. There are a lot of very good B-Ball players in the Northwest. They would need to evaluate their RPI to ~150 to fit into the existing WCC, sad but true. The WCC overall needs to improve. If they are really hungry, maybe they can be another driving factor in improving the WCC competition. They have a great history, alk SFU. Something UW, OSU, WSU, OU do not have. GU just has to keep raising the bar and hopefully, they will creat history for themselves.

NorthWestZag
05-13-2007, 10:02 PM
We should not play Seattle U until they are D-1.

I say we play them only in the MAC once a year. I am against them joining the WCC.

ZagNut08
05-13-2007, 11:10 PM
I would be in favor of scheduling them as part of our pre-season (first warm-up non-counting games)--- they can come and visit Spokane once a year.


my thoughts exactly, would rather play them than ucsd

Nevtelen
05-13-2007, 11:47 PM
I'm all for playing them as an exhibition game. They're better than any other team we'd get to do it. No way should we play them in the regular season until they're D-I. If they still want to do it then, we should switch them out with one of the couple of real cupcakes we do play - Idaho or some spot like UTSA this past year. I agree with most above - if they think they'll get us in a home-and-home, they have another think coming. Welcome to D-I, boys.

Birddog
05-14-2007, 04:59 AM
What nobody is mentioning is just how hard it is to schedule as an independent. SU has a major chore ahead in just filling out it's schedule, esp after other teams start league play, which can be in late Dec. A few years ago we played a directional Colo school (I forget the name) and they were very thankful because nobody wants to play an Indy trying to go D1. I believe we played that game because Coach Krause knew the coaches and we did it as a favor to them.

Many teams can afford to burn a game or two early in the season, but the RPI hit is too big late in the year. The Redhawks are going to feel like the Washington Nats for quite a few years. I figure we'll do them a favor once or twice, but that will be it until they can be considered top 100/150.

Birddog

PS A friend of mine just informed me that his nephew would be attending SU on a swimming scholly, can that be right?

Birddog

Angelo Roncalli
05-14-2007, 06:53 AM
They have a pretty decent D-2 swimming program.

gamagin
05-14-2007, 08:30 AM
if any of you, are looking at the Jesuit connection the way the Jebs do.

It would not take a great deal of shifting around to make SU look alot like GU in the area of management.

For e.g. Spitzer "could" be transferred to SU by the Province. Along with his connections and talents and ability to see big picture plans and execute orders re same.

He serves at some nearly anonymous Jesuit leader's pleasure after all. He's not bound to GU.

Or some other Jeb, whose name I don't know, but whose creds were built up helping GU raise money, could be transferred to SU (or anywhere) to help its flagging coffers.

Many, many, Jebs have served at both GU and SU over the years. W/distinction. To many of them, it's like working for IBM in the sense that it's all the same company. Only this one is the company of jesuits.

I know many here are big fans of Fr. Frank Costello. Well, I have friends who became lifelong friends of his while he was at SU.

I'm not saying SU is a lock for anything. But reality is if SU needs Jeb input, support and generally has the Oegon Province's (not sure if I am even using the right terms here) support, well, anything could happen.

And even if we disagre on the fine points here, no order has raised more money than the Jesuits over the years.

And there is no reason on earth that a ripe, rich area like Seattle can't be a source of tremendous funding should SU decide to be more like GU and begin that process by boosting any of its sports programs and start looking for deep pockets to help them do it.

Whenever I see an announcement like this, I think, well, it's up to the boosters and SU fans and alum to make this all happen. If they vote with their pocketbooks, it will, imo. If not, no way. the Jesuits will be there to make sure the word gets out and the possibilities are open.

If this were a stock, I'd invest in it. Not because I'm a SU fan. I'm not. but I have a great deal of admiration for the staying power of the Jesuits.

they can & have achieved amazing things throughout the centuries. And even if we limit our scope to GU, they do not.

They take the macro view and I think we should keep that in mind.

they were busy building private, Catholic schools under impossible odds. So getting a basketball program is no insurmountable challenge, "IF" the SU base is up to the task.

DrDrivel
05-14-2007, 09:10 AM
Birddog, I don't understand the assertion that teams "can afford to burn a game or two early in the season, but the RPI hit is too big late in the year."

RPI is blind to when you play a team and coaches know this. They schedule weaker teams early in the year so as to slowly build a team into tougher competition - not for RPI purposes. Please explain if I'm not getting your point.

Bocco
05-14-2007, 04:14 PM
I hope SU returns to D-1 and the WCC, if for no other reason that it will give us a game every year in Seattle, and a minimum of two games a year against a team in the Seattle area, and if the Montlake Chickens decide that they play us again we would have three games against teams in Seattle. It just might help our recruiting over there. However until/if they return to the WCC all games should be in the Spokane. Also another D-1 team in the northwest is another thorn in the side of the Chickens and anything that Hucks the Fuskies is okay by me.

SammamiZag
05-15-2007, 12:21 PM
I'm all for Seattle U in D-1., but am not so sure about them ever joining the WCC. Remember that this team beat Portland and Pacific in 05-06. Not exactly impressive to us (the Pacific win was a big deal to them at the time) but huge for any D2 school. However it ends up working out for them I hope they fit in well in whatever conference. Big Sky?