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View Full Version : OT: UT, OU, OSU TAMU stay in Big 12



Section 116
06-14-2010, 04:41 PM
Texas has elected to pass on the PAC-10's offer to join and Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, and Texas A&M pledged to stay has well. I would say this is a bit of surprise as it sounded as if the first three would most likely go to the PAC-10 with TAMU maybe headed to the SEC:

http://sports.yahoo.com/top/news;_ylt=AkKK9iExVrgPsdRd7804bCA5nYcB?slug=ap-big12-texas

Perhaps I should have added this one to the end of the WCC jumping ship thread. I didn't read all the way to the end of that one before I posted.

BobZag
06-14-2010, 04:57 PM
I wanted anarchy. Blast!

El Voce
06-14-2010, 05:23 PM
I just think it's great that the Pac-10's tradition-be-damned money grubbing is coming back to bite them in the arse. A Pac-11 (or Pac-12, if they add Utah) is not going to add up to the big dollars that the greedy AD's on the West Coast had in mind. In fact, it might hurt them long term if they have to divide bowl money 12 ways instead of 10.

Traditions matter.

Kiddwell
06-14-2010, 05:35 PM
Kiddwell may be cynical, but IMHO super-conferences are coming. If not now, then not many years hence.

The Next Big Question: How will all of that affect Dear Old GU?

:]

titopoet
06-15-2010, 06:54 AM
I just think it's great that the Pac-10's tradition-be-damned money grubbing is coming back to bite them in the arse. A Pac-11 (or Pac-12, if they add Utah) is not going to add up to the big dollars that the greedy AD's on the West Coast had in mind. In fact, it might hurt them long term if they have to divide bowl money 12 ways instead of 10.

Traditions matter.

If only it were true. Tradition did not have anything to do with saving the B-12 for now. What save the B-12 was the last ditch effort by Beebee who gave Texas everything it wanted and more. He pitched to the networks that if they pony up more money for a weakened B-12, they save money in the long run as they don't have to pay a premium of a super Pac-16. The Pac-12 (?) will do just fine with adding Utah and CU and creating its own TV network.

In the long run can the B-12 survive? Texas will have its own network and A&M will still be courted by the SEC. Kanas, KSU will move quietly to keep from being caught with their pants down again. All of the other members will look at Mizzu with a bit of suspicion. (If the B-10 called, Mizzu would have said yes.) Texas will be resented by the others for its power in the B-12. (The reason Nebraska left.) KU and KSU will certainly distrust the the rest of the bunch, knowing they they were almost through out into the cold. In such an atmosphere can the B-12 last. Tune it, and buckle your seats; it is going to be a bumpy ride.

kitzbuel
06-15-2010, 07:02 AM
If only it were true. Tradition did not have anything to do with saving the B-12 for now. What save the B-12 was the last ditch effort by Beebee who gave Texas everything it wanted and more. He pitched to the networks that if they pony up more money for a weakened B-12, they save money in the long run as they don't have to pay a premium of a super Pac-16. The Pac-12 (?) will do just fine with adding Utah and CU and creating its own TV network.

In the long run can the B-12 survive? Texas will have its own network and A&M will still be courted by the SEC. Kanas, KSU will move quietly to keep from being caught with their pants down again. All of the other members will look at Mizzu with a bit of suspicion. (If the B-10 called, Mizzu would have said yes.) Texas will be resented by the others for its power in the B-12. (The reason Nebraska left.) KU and KSU will certainly distrust the the rest of the bunch, knowing they they were almost through out into the cold. In such an atmosphere can the B-12 last. Tune it, and buckle your seats; it is going to be a bumpy ride.

Wow, kinda sounds like my family :D .

(fortunately not really; my family is no where near at all that dysfunctional!)

CDC84
06-15-2010, 08:02 AM
I don't think any of this effects Gonzaga now that the Big 12 has decided to keep their league going. If a super Pac 10 had developed, that may have been a problem. The only change that will occur within basketball is that the Big 12 will be a better basketball league without Colorado and Nebraska dragging the league down. Colorado and Utah (possibly) add nothing to the Pac 10 in terms of basketball except for travel miles.

GorgeZag
06-15-2010, 08:04 AM
If only it were true. Tradition did not have anything to do with saving the B-12 for now. What save the B-12 was the last ditch effort by Beebee who gave Texas everything it wanted and more. He pitched to the networks that if they pony up more money for a weakened B-12, they save money in the long run as they don't have to pay a premium of a super Pac-16. The Pac-12 (?) will do just fine with adding Utah and CU and creating its own TV network.

In the long run can the B-12 survive? Texas will have its own network and A&M will still be courted by the SEC. Kanas, KSU will move quietly to keep from being caught with their pants down again. All of the other members will look at Mizzu with a bit of suspicion. (If the B-10 called, Mizzu would have said yes.) Texas will be resented by the others for its power in the B-12. (The reason Nebraska left.) KU and KSU will certainly distrust the the rest of the bunch, knowing they they were almost through out into the cold. In such an atmosphere can the B-12 last. Tune it, and buckle your seats; it is going to be a bumpy ride.

Thats just it, the Pac-10 was striking first. The SEC already has a huge TV deal and the Big 10 was going to expand sooner or later so the Pac decided it had to do something to keep up, which it did. Unfortunatly for them they struck out. Adding Colorado may add the Denver market but it won't be nearly the TV deal that it could have been with the Texas schools. Now they either have to stay at 11 or add somebody like Utah which only dilutes the league. Now the Pac will have a weaker TV deal and the same bowl tie ins which should be a lot better. They lost alot of leverage here.
College sports are changing and I can't blame the Pac for trying to be bold. Whats funny is all the other Big 12 teams are getting bent over by Texas and are loving every second of it. It's truly Texas and the 9 puppies and someday one of them will grow tired of it just like Nebraska and we'll be right back to the expansion talk.

229SintoZag
06-15-2010, 01:44 PM
I just think it's great that the Pac-10's tradition-be-damned money grubbing is coming back to bite them in the arse. A Pac-11 (or Pac-12, if they add Utah) is not going to add up to the big dollars that the greedy AD's on the West Coast had in mind. In fact, it might hurt them long term if they have to divide bowl money 12 ways instead of 10.

Traditions matter.

Oh please. Get off your high horse El Voce.

If trying to land large TV money from ESPN, etc., as a way to build your schools' athletics programs is some sort of crime, Gonzaga is as guilty as anybody. Think about what we've put our team and fans through in the past few years to jump through ESPN's hoops.

Given the type of money schools in the SEC and now the Big 10 are making, the Pac 10 has a duty to its member schools to try to keep pace. They did nothing wrong in trying to take the creme of the Big 12 crop. Too bad it didn't work out.

Zagdawg
06-15-2010, 03:34 PM
If you mean by what "hoops" ESPN has put the Zags through ---like Gameday -- great national exposure and the ability for fans all over the country to see the Zags in action as being a negative-- I'm not sure that I agree with you.

The later games were not as fun-- but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad.

On a positive note at least we don't have a contract with Fox (which is our other option)-- ask the Pac about how much they like it.

Birddog
06-15-2010, 05:18 PM
On a positive note at least we don't have a contract with Fox (which is our other option)-- ask the Pac about how much they like it.
I wonder how I get all those games on FSNW via satellite down here in OK?

CDC84
06-15-2010, 09:14 PM
Gonzaga has an individual TV contract with FSN, while the Pac 10 has a league contract with FSN. Big difference. The Pac 10 schools are bound to that FSN contract for their home games and league games, which keeps a program like UCLA from getting more of its games on the ESPN channels.

Of course the WCC's contract with ESPN prevents more Gonzaga games from being shown on FSN, which probably lessens the dollar value of GU's TV contract with that company, but it's a better "problem" to have than what the Pac 10 schools must endure.

Coug Tracks
06-16-2010, 07:57 AM
If you mean by what "hoops" ESPN has put the Zags through ---like Gameday -- great national exposure and the ability for fans all over the country to see the Zags in action as being a negative-- I'm not sure that I agree with you.

The later games were not as fun-- but sometimes you have to take the good with the bad.

On a positive note at least we don't have a contract with Fox (which is our other option)-- ask the Pac about how much they like it.I think "the good with the bad" was SintoZag's point in the sense that there are tradeoffs in any decision you make. I believe the Pac 10 President's would have liked to keep the status quo and maintain the tradition that El Voce takes issue. The conference has positioned itself as a conference made up of like institutions (research, etc.) rather than one built around athletic programs and the geographic symmetry and diversity has also been important to all things Pac 10. However, maintaining relevance in a money driven business (and make no mistake that this is big business) made the decision to pursue conference expansion a relatively easy one.

Keep in mind that the expansion wasn't going to happen until 2012 or 2013. Texas has been in the proverbial "cat bird seat" but they probably did not want to look like the bad guy in breaking up the Big 12. They give the Big 12 (10) time to come up with a big TV deal, make their own network, and if it the new Big 12 doesn't work the Pac 10, Big 10, and SEC will still want them part of their conference. They are in the same position as Notre Dame and doing things on their own terms. They have that kind of power so why wouldn't they go about their business with this in mind.

Change is still coming.

CDC84
06-16-2010, 09:14 AM
http://www.sportingnews.com/college-basketball/article/2010-06-15/leaner-big-12-brings-tougher-better-scheduling


Nebraska and Colorado—which averaged a 5-11 conference record and RPI rank of 147 over the past four years, which have combined for a total of nine NCAA Tournament in 71 years (fewer than Duke and Butler combined for this season)—are leaving.

Texas and Kansas and Kansas State and Oklahoma State and Texas A&M and Baylor and Missouri—seven teams that reached the NCAA Tournament last season—have committed to remaining in the Big 12 for the foreseeable future.

Already, statistician Ken Pomeroy has declared the 10-team Big 12, had it been in place this past season, would have been the strongest league under his rating system since 2004. Even with Colorado and Nebraska, the Big 12 was the No. 1 conference in the Ratings Percentage Index standings by a decent margin.