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23dpg
03-05-2010, 07:55 AM
This is from the Seattle Times.


And in Jackson's case, what better player to have it than Kingma.

The 6-foot-2 junior guard, who has received a scholarship offer from Gonzaga and is being widely recruited by West Coast schools, had dreamed about such an opportunity.

From what I've read on the boards, this is probably not true at this time. Anyone know?

cjm720
03-05-2010, 08:32 AM
This is from the Seattle Times.


And in Jackson's case, what better player to have it than Kingma.

The 6-foot-2 junior guard, who has received a scholarship offer from Gonzaga and is being widely recruited by West Coast schools, had dreamed about such an opportunity.

From what I've read on the boards, this is probably not true at this time. Anyone know?

:link:

whatazag
03-05-2010, 08:39 AM
I thought I had read here a while back that he had been offered.
Since then it sounded like the staff had been cooling on him, so I get the feeling that recruits are in touch with the coaches and can get a feel for whether they can expect much of a chance at playing time if they do decide to commit.
In my opinion it never hurts to bring in a sharpshooter like Kingma, but I guess the concern is it could make it harder to land another guard the staff wants like Bell.

23dpg
03-05-2010, 09:33 AM
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/highschoolsports/2011261030_boysgame05.html

MDABE80
03-05-2010, 09:33 AM
Bell/Pangos with Dranginis/Kingma... make me weak kneed....I'm in a swoon over those options....quick...somebody get my fan;).

We'll get half of the above...I hope ( fingers crossed behind back)...Abe

ps I think the offers are time limited. He may have been offered but time passes...Harris is the one I liked. Joe!! Come back home !!!

mdZag23
03-05-2010, 10:40 AM
we need a pure shooter like Kingma and from what I've seen of him this year it would be a mistake to not sign a kid like him....assuming we have the chance.

SWEET, SWEET stroke! and creates shots very well.

BobZag
03-05-2010, 10:49 AM
I'll only say this one more time, then you can go on posting about Kingma all you want. I'll try my best to make this very, very clear.

GONZAGA IS NOT RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA. UW IS NOT RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA. NEITHER IS WSU, UO AND OSU. NO PAC-10 TEAMS ARE RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA.

Okay, continue on.

zagboni
03-05-2010, 10:56 AM
I'll only say this one more time, then you can go on posting about Kingma all you want. I'll try my best to make this very, very clear.

GONZAGA IS NOT RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA. UW IS NOT RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA. NEITHER IS WSU, UO AND OSU. NO PAC-10 TEAMS ARE RECRUITING BRETT KINGMA.

Okay, continue on.

And you know this how? Unless your one of his parents, I don't know how you would know this.

hooter73
03-05-2010, 11:26 AM
And you know this how? Unless your one of his parents, I don't know how you would know this.

aww newbies... :)

Zagatak
03-05-2010, 11:34 AM
And you know this how? Unless your one of his parents, I don't know how you would know this.

Three words for you. Never question BobZag.

zagboni
03-05-2010, 11:44 AM
So is Bobzag GU's version of the Pied Piper, if he says it, it has to be true. Seriously I would like to know how he would know that no pac 10 teams have offered and gonzaga hasn't offered. I am assuming that you are not Brett since he is at the state tourneament.

WMS2GUBULLDOG
03-05-2010, 11:53 AM
Obviously father-bob has some sort of insider info, look up any of his previous hints. An also, Brett Kingma clearly does not have high-major talent. The kid can stroke, but he has hint of athleticism. This is a glorified highschool player with an amazing stroke. He is a mid-level d-I talent player at best.

VinnyZag
03-05-2010, 12:27 PM
So is Bobzag GU's version of the Pied Piper, if he says it, it has to be true. Seriously I would like to know how he would know that no pac 10 teams have offered and gonzaga hasn't offered. I am assuming that you are not Brett since he is at the state tourneament.

I've never been clear why Bob knows things. But most of the time, what he says turns out to be true.*



* Except when he's foolin'. I don't think that's the case here.

zagboni
03-05-2010, 12:30 PM
Same thing they said about Steph Curry.

You guys are amazing, you have never seen a kid play, you watch videos, check out websites and determine if a kid has the talent to play D-1.

cjm720
03-05-2010, 12:32 PM
Same thing they said about Steph Curry.

You guys are amazing, you have never seen a kid play, you watch videos, check out websites and determine if a kid has the talent to play D-1.

I've only checked out Youtbe and read articles in the Times, and I KNOW he can play D1 ball.

zagboni
03-05-2010, 12:43 PM
I've only checked out Youtbe and read articles in the Times, and I KNOW he can play D1 ball.

my bad that was meant for wms2

WMS2GUBULLDOG
03-05-2010, 12:48 PM
I saw him play him play Kamiak and guess what he looked like big sky level talent. I actually go to a lot of westside games because I live there. Let me tell you something, from seeing Isiah, abdul, and avery, as well as josh smith play, Kingma does not have high major talent at all. Oh and by the way don't go on the boards blasting the most valuable member immediately and looking like an idiot. That is just pure ignorance, your ignorant.

RockandRollJames
03-05-2010, 12:51 PM
I saw him play him play Kamiak and guess what he looked like big sky level talent. I actually go to a lot of westside games because I live there. Let me tell you something, from seeing Isiah, abdul, and avery, as well as josh smith play, Kingma does not have high major talent at all. Oh and by the way don't go on the boards blasting the most valuable member immediately and looking like an idiot. That is just pure ignorance, your ignorant.

I played against Gaddy and Avery. Gaddy is not in the same conversation as Smith or Bradley. I said all along that Abdul was NOT that good. Sorry to get off topic. But I agree that Kingma is not that good. We don't want him.

zagfan08
03-05-2010, 12:52 PM
Gonzaga may not be, but Ken Bone and Lorenzo Romar (plus assistants) have been in attendance for games he's played this season. So there is definitely some sort of interest in him from those schools, maybe not offers though. The most PAC 10 interest probably at Wazzu (Bone recruited him at Portland St. and I believe Bone played college ball with Brett's dad at SPU).

Here's the thing with Kingma (I've played against him and watched him play several times).. He is a great shooter who shoots a poor percentage because he takes a lot of unnecessary shots since Jackson has little to no structure to their offense. He has the freedom to shoot whenever he wants, and he's not shy about it. So if an average game for him is 9-21 from the field, I think he'd probably go 8-16 under a coach that wouldn't allow him to shoot contested fadeaways early in the shot clock. As their best player, he creates and forces a lot, often facing double teams, which brings his percentage down. Put him in a college offense with skilled players around him and much more discipline, and he will be a steady shooter capable of filling it up. I'm still not sure if he fits into the plans of major D1 programs, but he will be successful with other players that can create things for him.

zag67
03-05-2010, 03:15 PM
I was at the tournament last night and watched him make an incredible shot at the end of the game. And yes he is a super shooter. But I will say if he signs with any major D-1 team, he will probably be redshirted the first year. He is thin as a rail and against any type guard that has some bulk, he would be pushed around. I therefore did not think he would be ready for a major contribution to any top level team. But do not get me wrong, he can shoot. He can pass. He does at times, relax too much on D and does not get back as fast as he should. But then other times he seemed to get to a solid defensive position.

dim4sum
03-05-2010, 03:27 PM
I've been clamoring for someone to post a video of Kingma on defense and in other non-scoring situations. From what I can see his speed is OK, not great, kind of Dan Dickauesque. He can help a team with a decent front line, creating an inside out threat. If he brings the managerial skills of say a Gerrity
of USC, a coach on the court, then that's just another feather in his cap. But from what I can see his ability to get open on threes would be contested by better players in the D-1 ranks. He's got plenty of time to add to the Plus in Three Point Shooter Plus category. Worse case scenario would be to pass him up only to see him with another WCC school--and with a score to settle for four years against the Zags.

heavyzag
03-05-2010, 04:02 PM
Very similar games and athleticism

btzag
03-05-2010, 06:19 PM
How about a comparison to Brad Tinsley of Oregon City two years back? Here was a guy who could light it up in HS but everyone questioned his athleticism and overall game. Then he gets snatched up by Vandy and has turned into a real nice CBB player at a top 25 program.

Maybe Kingma is not there but I will just say that the staff has been wrong before. It is very rare though so I will trust that the staff knows they are going after better players at this time.

BroncoZAG615
03-05-2010, 06:35 PM
How about a comparison to Brad Tinsley of Oregon City two years back? Here was a guy who could light it up in HS but everyone questioned his athleticism and overall game. Then he gets snatched up by Vandy and has turned into a real nice CBB player at a top 25 program.

Maybe Kingma is not there but I will just say that the staff has been wrong before. It is very rare though so I will trust that the staff knows they are going after better players at this time.

We lost a great player to Vanderbilt in 2008, but it was not Brad Tinsely. He's decent but would be in the same spot as Grant Gibbs if he was here.

dim4sum
03-05-2010, 07:44 PM
The kid is just 16. He scored 20 tonight against a helter skelter Federal Way team that played out of control at times. By next year, Kingma could be two inches taller ( a coveted tall guard) and develop smarts he doesn't yet have.
There have been cases in recent years--such as LeBron James and Aaron Brooks, believe it or not--where scouts identified future pros in the first year of middle school. Kingma isn't such an animal, but look how he's leading his team. Put it this way, he's better than Dickau as a high school junior. Kingma showed some toughness and leadership tonight. He made clutch free throws down the stretch and kept his mates focused. But is he a Zag? In my book he's kind of a throwback Zag to the Dickau-Stepp days. If that's still good enough than he's a Zag. But he's not a Zag in the super athlete sense like Elias Harris. Few are.

MickMick
03-05-2010, 09:04 PM
Dranginis, Bell, Wiltjer, and Pangos.

Those are the guys on my wish list. One has already told Utah State where he is headed and it apparently isn't there.

The Rotnei Clarke thing really wore me down. I just can't get into the hype of potential recruits like I used too.

To the coaches....surprise us with more guys like Harris.

rawkmandale
03-05-2010, 10:01 PM
By Mason Kelley
Seattle Times staff reporter

Mason Kelley's High School Sports Blog
TACOMA This is one dream Brett Kingma doesn't want to end.

The longer it lasts, the crazier it gets. This three-day stretch is so foreign to Jackson's junior standout, he can't quite figure out how to celebrate.

As the final seconds ticked off the clock in Jackson's 53-45 upset of top-ranked, defending champion Federal Way, Kingma put both hands on top of his head. He looked dazed.

Then it hit him, sort of.

"Oh, my God," he mouthed as he walked down the floor. Then he pointed toward the rafters with both hands. Then he walked aimlessly around the floor. Then he hit two free throws.

When the Class 4A boys basketball semifinal game finally ended, he was so shocked he ran the wrong way. This postseason run might take some time to sink in, but one thing is certain: The Timberwolves will play for the state championship at 7 p.m. on Saturday.

Jackson's opponent will be Kentwood, a 57-44 winner over Wilson of Tacoma in the late semifinal.

"We knew we were the underdogs," said Kingma, who scored 25. "We just came out loose. We were like, 'Hey, let's make it the miracle on the hardwood.' "

Kingma was so loose before the game he let the Timberwolves' cheerleaders paint his toenails pink and green. He then staked his team to a 6-0 advantage with a three, a jumper and a free throw.

He set the tone early, getting open shots by working screens like vintage Reggie Miller. His teammates took care of the defense with Mike Wishko, Austin O'Keefe and Andy Gay bottling up Federal Way senior Cole Dickerson.

"I think we really believed," Jackson coach Steve Johnson said. "I think we defended great."

Federal Way senior Isiah Umipig picked up his second foul with 3:04 left to play in the first quarter and the Eagles struggled without their floor general. The Timberwolves (23-4) pushed the lead to 12 by halftime and 16 after a Kingma three in the third quarter.

Like they did in the quarterfinals against Gonzaga Prep, the Eagles (25-3) responded. They ripped off eight straight, including a two-handed dunk by Dickerson that seemed to be the momentum play that would spark another late rally.

"That was a great momentum boost," said Umipig, who scored 12. "They caught back on fire, started making more shots."

Marshall Massengale hit a three at the third-quarter buzzer. He let his wrist hang in the air before balling his fist and throwing a haymaker.

Ryan Todd kept the Eagles at bay with six straight Jackson points in the fourth quarter.

"It's like living this dream," said Todd, who had 12 rebounds.

This surreal run has pleasantly dazed the Timberwolves.

When Kingma finally found his way to the bench after the win, he stood on a chair and threw his hands toward the roof once again. Maybe one day this will all sink in for the Timberwolves. Not yet. Not right now.

"We're just a bunch of guys that live in a little neighborhood next to a little outside basketball hoop and mess around in the summer," Kingma said.

FEDERAL WAY Tyrell Lewis 3-5 0-0 7, Isiah Umipig 5-13 0-0 12, Jerry Duckworth 1-4 0-0 3, D'Londo Tucker 0-0 0-0 0, Roosevelt Jones 1-3 0-0 2, Robert Christopher 3-11 1-3 7, George Williams 1-4 2-4 4, Cole Dickerson 5-11 0-0 10. Totals 19-51 3-7 45.

JACKSON Brett Kingma 7-20 7-10 25, Ryan Todd 3-4 0-0 6, Andy Gay 0-1 0-0 0, Marshall Massengale 3-6 1-3 9, Austin O'Keefe 3-5 1-3 7, Mason Golchrist 1-2 2-2 4, Mike Wishko 0-2 2-2 2. Totals 17-40 13-20 53.

Three-point shooting Federal Way 4-15 (Umipig 2-9); Jackson 6-19 (Kingma 4-13). Rebounds Federal Way 27 (Christopher 9); Jackson 39 (Todd 12). Assists Federal Way 7 (Umipig 2, Christopher 2); Jackson 9 (Wishko 4). Steals Federal Way 5 (Dickerson 2); Jackson 2 (O'Keefe 1, Golchrist 1). Blocked shots Federal Way 2 (Christopher 1, Williams 1); Jackson 2 (Gay 1, O'Keefe 1). Fouled out Dickerson, Federal Way.

jake
03-05-2010, 10:06 PM
How about a comparison to Brad Tinsley of Oregon City two years back? Here was a guy who could light it up in HS but everyone questioned his athleticism and overall game. Then he gets snatched up by Vandy and has turned into a real nice CBB player at a top 25 program.



Tinsley is very athletic. He might not be Errol Knight, but he has pretty explosive jumping ability. I admit that I've never seen Kingma play in person. From the YouTube clips (not the best source) he looks like the kind of guy that might give a Top 25 team fits playing for the opposition but may not beat any of the same guys for minutes if on the same team. I will trust those with more knowledge than me to make the final call.

mrob7
03-05-2010, 10:31 PM
Zags better swipe him up before BYU does..

bigparb
03-05-2010, 10:55 PM
The kid is just 16. He scored 20 tonight against a helter skelter Federal Way team that played out of control at times. By next year, Kingma could be two inches taller ( a coveted tall guard) and develop smarts he doesn't yet have.
There have been cases in recent years--such as LeBron James and Aaron Brooks, believe it or not--where scouts identified future pros in the first year of middle school. Kingma isn't such an animal, but look how he's leading his team. Put it this way, he's better than Dickau as a high school junior. Kingma showed some toughness and leadership tonight. He made clutch free throws down the stretch and kept his mates focused. But is he a Zag? In my book he's kind of a throwback Zag to the Dickau-Stepp days. If that's still good enough than he's a Zag. But he's not a Zag in the super athlete sense like Elias Harris. Few are.

I don't know if Kingma should be a Zag or not.....I've posted some things here that I've heard, but to be fair, i have never seen him play in person.....that said, I'll take a throwback Dickau-Stepp type guard any day of the week.....my god people, we are only talking about two of the best guards to ever play at GU....bring that type of kid on!!!!! Bigparb longs for the days of seeing Zags bomb 3's......and don't tell me we've got that now.....gray should be that guy, but his 3 ball has been poor this year, and Bouldin just doesn't have that pure stroke....and bol don't play/shoot enough to count yet... :)

WMS2GUBULLDOG
03-05-2010, 11:11 PM
Watched another game of his tonight on Comcast. Kid can shoot, but not much else. Can't explode out of screens, definitely not a pg, had some mental issues in regard to toughness, definitely could be a system guy in a place like byu or portland, not zag material, doesn't have the iq or the athleticism. Already plays in a flex-system if that helps, but definitely doesn't create his own shot.

zagfan08
03-05-2010, 11:24 PM
Watched another game of his tonight on Comcast. Kid can shoot, but not much else. Can't explode out of screens, definitely not a pg, had some mental issues in regard to toughness, definitely could be a system guy in a place like byu or portland, not zag material, doesn't have the iq or the athleticism. Already plays in a flex-system if that helps, but definitely doesn't create his own shot.

Sorry but you're just wrong. I know him, have played with and against him, and there are some things to criticize but mental toughness, basketball IQ, and creating his own shot? You must not watch very closely.

He battled the number 1 team in the state for 25 points in a huge upset win in the semifinals, not sure what zag material is anymore, but it was a Dickau like performance (no, he won't be Dan Dickau, just compare from a physical and style standpoint). He's playing for the state championship tomorrow night with a team that won 3 loser-out games to get to state.

Lack of IQ probably relates to shooting a lot. He's a very confident shooter who looks for his shot. It's rare that I see him pass one up. He understands the game better than most.

Most of his shots come off the dribble, so if that's not creating your own shot then I don't know what is. And as far as athleticism goes, he is skinny but has dunked a few times this year and gets several steals defensively.

At no point have I said Gonzaga should offer him, I'm not sure he's good enough to play here at this point. But we should be keeping an eye on him, especially after this state tournament. He's one game away from winning it almost by himself.

ZaggyZaggerson
03-05-2010, 11:56 PM
Brett Kingma is NOT a D-1 player. Look at the way he runs. He's very, very unathletic. He's not very quick. Granted, he has a sweet stroke, but at D-1, he gets eaten alive by athleticism. Shut down. Shut out. Period.

SLOZag
03-06-2010, 12:18 AM
Brett Kingma is NOT a D-1 player.

Ironically, in class 4A play tonight his Jackson team (rated # 10 in the state) just upset Federal Way (rated # 1 in the state; coming off the defeat of G-Prep), 53 - 45. Federal Way is led by future D-1 player Cole Dickerson. Brett provided the offensive spark for the Timberwolves, scoring 16 of his game-high 25 points in the first half.

Read more: http://www.thenewstribune.com/2010/03/06/1098295/upset-of-century-dethrones-eagles.html#ixzz0hO2E9plw

azzagfan
03-06-2010, 05:26 AM
For some reason, this thread made me laugh as I read it. I've never seen Kingma play, but he's obviously a very, very good high school player, and it sounds like he's a pretty good shooter.

The Tinsley and Rotnei Clarke comments are what made me laugh. One, Tinsley is the starting PG for a very solid Vandy team. He's struggled shooting the ball from outside this year, but otherwise has been very solid for an NCAA-caliber team. Rotnei Clarke averages 15.6 PPG for a middle of the road SEC team, and who knows what that could be with a Zag-type offense. Both shoot 80%+ on FTs, which mean they're great to have to close out wins at the end of games, something the current Zag team (outside of Bouldin) is struggling with. Something that Monson and Few have said, when they were building this program, that they looked for in recruits was that they could shoot the ball and they knew how to win. At a minimum, Kingma seems to have those two pieces down.

I still fear that the Zags may end up with Vandy as their opponent in the NCAAs, and a lifelong Zag fan will come out and play out of his mind to beat the team that "wasn't interested".

webspinnre
03-06-2010, 08:03 AM
I'm not sure if Kingma has the athleticism to play at the elite level of D1, but he sure looks to have the talen to play somewhere in D1. I don't understand this not a D1 talent business.

WMS2GUBULLDOG
03-06-2010, 08:22 AM
Tinsley would be great for us to have, and rotnei clark is more than just an amazing shooter, they guy is smart and knows how to use screens. Zagfan08 I appreciate the comments and opinions, but I have to disagree. He played off ball for most of the game, and whenever he tried to run the lane he got swatted. Now, He ran tons off-ball screens, and he was not exploding hard off of them, nor, was he tight to the screens as he ran past them. And the kid can't dunk, he does the thing where they scoop it in than grab the rim to make it look like he throws down. Not saying dunking matters. He did have a lot of steals, but the kid definitely doesn't have the same shot off the dribble as he does in a catch and shoot. Definitely a d-1 talent, but he is a system guy and I think portland would be perfect for him or BYU, our system now requires handles or height if your a catch and shoot guy.

rawkmandale
03-06-2010, 09:14 AM
[QUOTE=rawkmandale;545889]"We knew we were the underdogs," said Kingma, who scored 25. "We just came out loose. We were like, 'Hey, let's make it the miracle on the hardwood.' "

Kingma was so loose before the game he let the Timberwolves' cheerleaders paint his toenails pink and green. He then staked his team to a 6-0 advantage with a three, a jumper and a free throw.[QUOTE=rawkmandale;545889]


Hey, a talented scorer that plays loose and lets cheerleaders paint his toenails the school colors sounds like Zag material to me. Playing loose in big games is a huge thing.

mrob7
03-06-2010, 02:17 PM
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/highschoolsportsblog/2011274534_video_jackson-federal_way_high.html

Highlights from the game last night.

You can watch brett play on FSN tonight at 7pm (west coast only)

Rangerzag
03-06-2010, 06:24 PM
Might as well show this too:


http://media.thenewstribune.com/smedia/2010/03/05/20/FWAY_JACKSON.highlight.prod_affiliate.5.JPG




LUI KIT WONG / Staff photographer
Believe it: Jackson's Bret Kingma has a look of shock near the end of the Timberwolves' upset of topr-ranked Federal Way in the boys Class 4A semifinals Friday at the Tacoma Dome.


http://www.thenewstribune.com/2010/03/05/1098059/jackson-stuns-no-1-federal-way.html?storylink=mirelated

ZagLawGrad
03-06-2010, 06:43 PM
Halftime and Jackson is behind Kentwood. Kingma is non-existent. Unless a miracle happens, Kingma is not a Zag quality player.

And Josh Smith is as slow as mud. Was high on him a year ago, but let UCLA have him.

guniverse
03-07-2010, 09:29 AM
i think that recruiting three guards in te same class is a little silly because at least one of them is not getting plaing time for te first two years. hopefully only one of them gets significant time due to quality upper classmen ahead of them. this means that two are not getting minutes. if you need someone to come in their is a special matchup need, either offensiv and shooting or defense. with dranginis i think we already have that and even more so than kingma. bell would be a different type of player that cold offer that defensive spark off the bench at the guard position. i only see recruiting mor than two guards if we get franklin since he leaves for the league after two years and allows one of the other two to step in as an upperclassmen. i do not see minutes for kingma at any time at gu if he does go there. if we offer him he comes for a year and transfers so he cannot beat us by transferring to another wcc school, that would be the only upside. not a good idea for us to offer him or for him to accept if he ever wants to play. by the way stop wastng your time wishing tinsley was here, would not start and too similar of a game to bouldin just much less talented.