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gamagin
11-10-2009, 12:15 PM
I was working outside this am and listening to 1510 sports show (accidentally after the Rome show).

They played a clip asking Few to assess the injury/recuperation/return of Bol Kong. I believe it was from the coach's Monday radio show on their station.

I was nowhere near a pencil and paper, either, but Few essentially said that Kong needs to step up his practice efforts, "learn to play with a little pain" and suggested if he did not, he was going to be passed up quickly on the roster.

Few then added that BK's already behind.

Few clearly sounded irritated at Kong's situation.

Few said Kong needed to get busy sooner than later. "This isn't playground ball." Coach then went on to say, and I paraphrase: "everyone does not get to play auotomatically. Everyone doesn't necessarily get a turn. Everyone has to compete to play and that's what he has to do, too. He has to learn to play through some pain, step up the effort. Everyone has to learn to do that." He noted there was loads of talent and everyone was working hard, and needed to work hard, to get p.t. this year.

It rang pretty clearly that Mr. kong needs to get some toughness post haste, in coach's opinion.

My thought (and only mine) after hearing coach was if BK doesn't step up, or show some progress in practice sooner than later, he may be looking at a redshirt.

If anyone knows how to pull up 1510 kga we might be able to hear it in Few's voice.

On another topic, a seattle times sports writer (name escaped me) was interviewed and said UW doesn't want to play GU in spokane because they can't get 6k UW fans into the Spokane arena (assuming both would go along with that site in the first place). Whereas they "could" get their half into the stands at the key arena. The reporter added that "GU, conversely, could get 6k fans into the key arena" and both schools could make an estimated $300k apiece for the matchup. "From UW's perspective, the key would be half full of GU fans, anyway."

He said playing in the K2 would earn UW nothing. I guess this assumes the gu fans would fill the k2 & wouldn't pay the dawgs to whup em.

all fodder for you who follow this particular effort closer than I do.



Go TEAM Zags !

webspinnre
11-10-2009, 12:24 PM
Apparently all UW cares about is $$.

Nevtelen
11-10-2009, 12:25 PM
IIRC Kong can't redshirt - he used his RS year waiting to get into the U.S. That means he's a RS Soph right now and he needs to put up or shut up pretty quickly probably. I'm sure it's a tough adjustment, but I hope Kong manages to get into gear sooner rather than later. It's not hard to get relegated to gargabe time with this roster.

On a side note, I wonder if Kong will play on Sat. Realisitcally, it will probably be enough of a blow-out that most if not all the players who want to will get in (yes, yes, don't overlook them, etc. But I'm not the team, so I can prognosticate).

Zerogame
11-10-2009, 12:29 PM
This does not bode well for Mr. Kong. I hope I'm wrong, I really wanted to see this kids show his stuff. When he didn't appear for the autograph table something just didn't seem right. I would say he is in Mr. Few's doghouse. Here's hoping he gets it going real soon. For both himself and the team.

Good luck Bol.

thickman1
11-10-2009, 12:48 PM
If Few is giving Kong a tongue-lashing via the public airwaves I have to assume the lashing was even worse at practice or behind doors at a meeting. I can't see his first effort to light a fire under Mr. Kong was through the media.

BroncoZAG615
11-10-2009, 12:57 PM
Is this honestly a surprise?

Bol has not played structured basketball in over a year, has never played against this type of competition before, and has never been pushed the way he is now by Few. He may be a bit older than guys like Manny, GJ, Sam, and the others but he is behind in overall basketball experience. People tend to forget that while Elias was playing against men in European leagues, Manny and Kelly were playing against the world's best young players, and GJ and Sam were played AAU ball and then working out in Spokane, Bol was played outdoor pickup basketball and helping run and participate in camps.

I'm a little surprised that Coach Few made these comments to be honest. He knows Bol's situation and the basketball background he came from. He's a workout phenom but the NCAA is a whole new animal and I'd like to see Few handle this behind closed doors rather than publicly dog him.

gamagin
11-10-2009, 01:00 PM
so this is a little tighter than the first take:

Few said in answer to Bol's status:

"yeah, he spraind his ankle, (then) he hurt his other leg. He's gotta compete and if he can't fight through it and compete, the bus is gonna leave.

"And that's what's happening. We're not in ymca ball where we all get equal time.

"He's a great kid but there's competition and if your not competing, guys are passing you by. He's now on the outside looking in.

"He's gotta play with a little discomfort & pain, because right now others are ahead of him."

re TX scrim:

re tx game. few was asked: did you see what you expected ? oh yeah. We're ahead of where we were at. I hope we continue to improve, the positives are I think we can play off those things, but we just have alot of things we gotta do -- especially with the non league-schedule.

Baldwinzag
11-10-2009, 01:30 PM
Few essentially said that Kong needs to step up his practice efforts, "learn to play with a little pain" and suggested if he did not, he was going to be passed up quickly on the roster.

Few then added that BK's already behind.

Few clearly sounded irritated at Kong's situation.

..."He has to learn to play through some pain, step up the effort. Everyone has to learn to do that."

It rang pretty clearly that Mr. kong needs to get some toughness post haste, in coach's opinion.


Thanks for sharing, Gamagin.

In an earlier thread re: Bol, I was berated my numerous posters for inquiring about Bol's ankle injury and why he wasn't playing and other players with more serious injuries chose to play. I was "kindly" accussed of starting false rumors, planting seeds of negativity, and being a gossip hound. According to Coach Few, it appears it was worth questioning...my earlier post:


I couldn't help but notice how Coach Few took a few moments during the post-game interview to recognize Kelly Olynyk for playing on a sprained ankle, considering he'd left it up to him to play or sit out this game. Few said Kelly chose to give it a go and was really impressed with his "toughness" as a player. Its interesting, since most students have seen Bol walking without a cast or any noticable limp, I'd be curious to know if Bol Kong was given the same option as Kelly prior the the game? There are varying degrees of sprains, yet its going on 10+ days since it occured. I wonder if it was Bol's decision to sit out, and maybe just maybe, Kong isn't so accustomed to matching up vs players as equally talented as him....I did hear Bol was medically cleared to play in last night's exhibition. Is it just a rumor, I wouldn't know....I just hope Bol is healthy enough to see the court by our next scrimmage.

BobZag
11-10-2009, 01:41 PM
It's not about Bol being rusty or out of organized ball for so long, it's about playing through the same pain all the others do.

Pargo the Destroyer
11-10-2009, 01:44 PM
In an earlier thread re: Bol, I was berated my numerous posters for inquiring about Bol's ankle injury and why he wasn't playing and others were with more serious injuries. I was "kindly" accussed of starting false rumors, planting seeds of negativity, and being a gossip hound. According to Coach Few, it appears it was worth questioning...

seems to be the way with some around here. Very easy to hide behind a handle and accuse people of things.

Regardless, were pulling for you BK!

Postplayer57
11-10-2009, 01:46 PM
With the time and effort expended by Coach Few and Gonzaga to bring Bol to G.U., perhaps he thought a starting spot and long minutes were sort of guaranteed?, and found out that was not the case.

CaliforniaZaggin'
11-10-2009, 01:56 PM
In an earlier thread re: Bol, I was berated my numerous posters for inquiring about Bol's ankle injury and why he wasn't playing and other players with more serious injuries chose to play. I was "kindly" accussed of starting false rumors, planting seeds of negativity, and being a gossip hound. According to Coach Few, it appears it was worth questioning.

Great instincts on the BK injury, Baldwin. But I think the criticism was for fanning the fires of an unsavory rumor w/o something more substantial to back it up (like these comments from Mark Few), and, FWIW, you appeared to agree with that...



I know, I know -- that is why I called myself out in my own post. It wasn't OK to plant such a hypothesis that hasn't been proven. Its just several of the Zag fans I have spoken to recently have mentioned similar "theories" why Bol hasn't played in the pre-season and why other players whom have been dealing with similar or worse injuries have been playing. I did hear Bol was medically cleared to play last night. Is it just a rumor, I wouldn't know. I agree with the poster above in holding out until it counts. Making false assumptions is not the right thing to do -- especially when it comes to dealing with injuries, which can be very subjective. I'll give Bol the benefit of the doubt. No one knows Bol's body better than himself. I apologize if I offended anyone on this board with my comment.

gamagin
11-10-2009, 02:02 PM
How many recall the same sort of dressing down of others over the years ?

The good news: it's usually aimed at players the Few et al, like, or have great hopes for. The ones they believe have real potential.

I remember the various times when JH would be peeled back like bark. And JP, too. I'm sure you all have a favorite in your time at school or as fans. I do not recall someone the staff has given up on being chastized like that. Like two other Canadians who didn't finish the program.

It's all about growing up, straightening up, toughening up, faster than the individual athlete had in mind. Meeting the new rules. Realizing one is a long ways from the recruiting station and the smiles when bootcamp begins.

And that preparing for war is nothing like even enduring a little inconvenience like bootcamp, because in the end, the live fire that is sure to follow is nothing compared to all of the other things.

And that's where BK needs to get because the feeling is, in this particular snapshot, he is not keeping up.

So here's hoping he realizes this is REALLY why he came to GU and that the opportunity being extended is just too good to pass up -- just like nearly all the others who have fought their ways through this rite of passage, and emerged as champions.

Go Bol !

Go TEAM Zags !

CaliforniaZaggin'
11-10-2009, 02:04 PM
I'm a little surprised that Coach Few made these comments to be honest. He knows Bol's situation and the basketball background he came from. He's a workout phenom but the NCAA is a whole new animal and I'd like to see Few handle this behind closed doors rather than publicly dog him.

Well struck, Bronc. I couldn't agree more.

VinnyZag
11-10-2009, 02:12 PM
it's about playing through the same pain all the others do.

Anybody else wonder if this contributes to the rash of injuries GU suffers every year? Are they pushing kids too much to 'play through pain' instead of letting kids heal completely?

NEC26
11-10-2009, 02:14 PM
Well struck, Bronc. I couldn't agree more.

Give me a break. Can people no longer be criticized? If you are never pushed how will you excel?

ZagNative
11-10-2009, 02:19 PM
I remember well when Coach Few called Micah out not long after he arrived and also talking about P-Mac "the philosopher." I suspect everything he says in public is for a reason, to light a fire. I know that Few cares about these kids and I trust him to act in the kids' best interests long term.

Pargo the Destroyer
11-10-2009, 02:23 PM
I remember well when Coach Few called Micah out not long after he arrived and also talking about P-Mac "the philosopher." I suspect everything he says in public is for a reason, to light a fire. I know that Few cares about these kids and I trust him to act in the kids' best interests long term.

yes yes YES.

JPtheBeasta
11-10-2009, 02:23 PM
IIRC Kong can't redshirt - he used his RS year waiting to get into the U.S. That means he's a RS Soph right now and he needs to put up or shut up pretty quickly probably. I'm sure it's a tough adjustment, but I hope Kong manages to get into gear sooner rather than later. It's not hard to get relegated to gargabe time with this roster.

On a side note, I wonder if Kong will play on Sat. Realisitcally, it will probably be enough of a blow-out that most if not all the players who want to will get in (yes, yes, don't overlook them, etc. But I'm not the team, so I can prognosticate).

Please, if you get the chance, a little more clarification might help. I have always taken the phrase "put up or shut up" to imply a malcontent or a lot complaining going on. Is that the case here? Or did you mean it more in the sense of Bol needing to grab his lunch pail and get to work? These carry different connotations, one of which is (whether true or untrue) potentially damaging to his character.

As for Few's comments, I'm relieved by the actual radio show quote, because I took it more as Few being pragmatic and realistic- just describing the situation as it stands right now- as opposed to using the media to reach a guy who isn't getting the message.

BroncoZAG615
11-10-2009, 02:23 PM
It's not about Bol being rusty or out of organized ball for so long, it's about playing through the same pain all the others do.

I disagree. I think when you play organized basketball at the level the rest of the freshmen were, you learn how to deal with bumps, bruises, and just emotional exhaustion. I'm not excusing Bol from being soft because none of us know the extent of his injury but let's not exaggerate his ability to handle pain. Playing ball four hours a day against guys as good and better than him is not something he is used to. There are just so many different aspects to his situation that are so rare that I just don't understand why a comment was necessary. A simple "he's doing fine" or "he's learning to deal with the difficulty of college basketball" would have been more than sufficient. He has to know that many Gonzaga fans hang on his every word and now all sorts of connotations will be hooked on to Bol well before many of us even see him play.

I think gamagin made a great point however. Coach Few obviously expects a lot from Bol but I think we've seen in the past that different players react differently to public criticism. Keep it in the lines and out of the press.

Zerogame
11-10-2009, 02:26 PM
It is quite possible Bol has been getting his lunch handed to him in drills due to his lack of playing for 2 years. His confidence might be totally eroded. An excuse, any excuse can come in handy rather than admit your getting beat. Once the confidence is gone…it is so hard to get it back. I know from personal experience how that happens. Guys I use to beat like a drum had caught up to me due to a missed season. I never got it back and finally quit. I regret that decision to this day, some 30 plus years later. I think if my coach had challenged me the way Coach Few is with Bol, It might have pissed me off enough to prove him wrong. It may not work, but in "Few" I trust.

Of course this is total speculation. I'm not trying to bismirch anyone here just thinking about the situation.

cjm720
11-10-2009, 02:31 PM
Give me a break. Can people no longer be criticized? If you are never pushed how will you excel?

THANK YOU FOR POINTING THIS OUT. Maybe we should give him a trophy for a nice effort??? Our society is creating a bunch of pu$$y's.

NotoriousZ
11-10-2009, 02:34 PM
This shouldn't be that hard to figure out. If his ankle is that bad, he'll sit on the bench. If his ankle is o.k. enough but he doesn't put the work in on the court, he'll sit on the bench. If he shows Few that he's ready, he'll get some playing time. It looks like we're running an eleven man rotaion without him anyway, so maybe it's best that he sit out this year anyway to heal up and gain some strength (even though he can't redshirt).

CDC84
11-10-2009, 02:36 PM
The bottom line is this: the 2009/10 Zags can't afford any slackers. There is no margin for error. Each guy has to bring it. If you don't, you sit, because this team is deep enough to replace you.

cjm720
11-10-2009, 02:37 PM
I disagree. I think when you play organized basketball at the level the rest of the freshmen were, you learn how to deal with bumps, bruises, and just emotional exhaustion. I'm not excusing Bol from being soft because none of us know the extent of his injury but let's not exaggerate his ability to handle pain. Playing ball four hours a day against guys as good and better than him is not something he is used to. There are just so many different aspects to his situation that are so rare that I just don't understand why a comment was necessary. A simple "he's doing fine" or "he's learning to deal with the difficulty of college basketball" would have been more than sufficient. He has to know that many Gonzaga fans hang on his every word and now all sorts of connotations will be hooked on to Bol well before many of us even see him play.

I think gamagin made a great point however. Coach Few obviously expects a lot from Bol but I think we've seen in the past that different players react differently to public criticism. Keep it in the lines and out of the press.

Wasn't Bol with NEDA for quite some time this year?

Few's obviously trying to light a fire under his butt and I highly doubt Bol hasn't heard this...Few's a good coaching doing what good coaches do. He motivates.

Go Zags!!

NEC26
11-10-2009, 02:38 PM
I have a friend who is a math teacher and he is forced to grade tests on completion rather than if the answers are actually correct. He is very frustrated because many students simply don't understand what they are doing but they are getting good grades. HOW DOES THAT HELP THEM? By making them feel good about them selves? You cannot improve unless people are willing to point out what needs to be done better. This idea that Few is calling him out is ridiculous he is simply stating the fact that he needs to toughen up or get left behind.

Baldwinzag
11-10-2009, 02:43 PM
I think the comments made by Coach Few say a lot about our team this year and the expectations they must have for this squad. We know Bol is extremely talented and has a ton of potential as a player. If other young players on this team are "passing him by", then what does that say about those other players? They must be working their tail off, giving a ton of effort/heart, and pretty darn talented to boot. Also, If Bol is on "the outside looking in", the players on the 'inside' must be making things happen and playing at a high level. I admire Coach Few for calling out Bol, b/c he wants every single player, especially our most gifted, to play hard at all times and reach their potential or else they won't play this season. This is all great news, IMO. Bol will be just fine and, if anything, this is a compliment to the rest of the team.

Go Zags! Play with grit, determination, and heart! Give it your all!

sonuvazag
11-10-2009, 02:48 PM
What was expressed in this interview was going to become obvious in Coach Few's playing time decisions over the next few weeks, anyway.

BroncoZAG615
11-10-2009, 02:51 PM
Wasn't Bol with NEDA for quite some time this year?

Few's obviously trying to light a fire under his butt and I highly doubt Bol hasn't heard this...Few's a good coaching doing what good coaches do. He motivates.

Go Zags!!

Yep he did some training with Greg Francis for a bit. Here is a bit more on that from an article when Bol got in the states:


He has not played on a formal team since, but recently spent time with Basketball Canada's National Elite Development Academy (NEDA) in Ontario.
"He had to get down to the States because that is an environment in which he can flourish,” said Jamie Oei, Kong's former head coach at Douglas. “So it's great to see him get there so he can go about having a really great career."
Randy Nohr, the former Canadian national team player and current lead assistant coach of the UBC men's team, said he saw Kong playing on the outdoor courts over the summer in Vancouver, and felt that Kong's NEDA experience has been a positive.
"He's improved his game in the past year," said Nohr of Kong, who has a seven-foot wingspan and all variety of shots in his arsenal, including a silky-smooth jumper from three-point range. "He looked better than he did a couple of years ago."
Said Kong in Sept. of 2007 to The Province: "It's like teasing you to come, but you can't get there. But if I get in, it will be great. Like this huge weight has finally been lifted."
By all reports, that's precisely how he felt on Wednesday.

NEC, I think criticism is great and I think it works with your friends students and with players in college basketball. Few can criticize all he wants, it was just my humble opinion to keep this kind of stuff in between the lines. If Bol was some five-star kid from Seattle that had played elite level AAU basketball and high school basketball for the past four years, I would have a different opinion but it is important to keep some perspective. I guess, to go along with your comparison, I don't think your friend should publish kids math test results in the school paper.

NEC26
11-10-2009, 02:57 PM
Yep he did some training with Greg Francis for a bit. Here is a bit more on that from an article when Bol got in the states:



NEC, I think criticism is great and I think it works with your friends students and with players in college basketball. Few can criticize all he wants, it was just my humble opinion to keep this kind of stuff in between the lines. If Bol was some five-star kid from Seattle that had played elite level AAU basketball and high school basketball for the past four years, I would have a different opinion but it is important to keep some perspective. I guess, to go along with your comparison, I don't think your friend should publish kids math test results in the school paper.
My point is society as a whole needs to toughen up. What would be so bad about public grades? I bet their would be some more motivated students. Do you think its wrong for the parents to get reports or is that too embarrassing? We need to face reality not live in fantasy land. What Few said was hardly a public undressing just a statement of fact.

JPtheBeasta
11-10-2009, 03:04 PM
IIRC Kong can't redshirt - he used his RS year waiting to get into the U.S. That means he's a RS Soph right now and he needs to put up or shut up pretty quickly probably. I'm sure it's a tough adjustment, but I hope Kong manages to get into gear sooner rather than later. It's not hard to get relegated to gargabe time with this roster.

On a side note, I wonder if Kong will play on Sat. Realisitcally, it will probably be enough of a blow-out that most if not all the players who want to will get in (yes, yes, don't overlook them, etc. But I'm not the team, so I can prognosticate).

Please, if you get the chance, a little more clarification might help. I have always taken the phrase "put up or shut up" to imply a malcontent or a lot complaining going on. Is that the case here? Or did you mean it more in the sense of Bol needing to grab his lunch pail and get to work? These carry different connotations, one of which is (whether true or untrue) potentially damaging to his character.

As for Few's comments, I'm relieved by the actual quote, because I took it more as Few being pragmatic and realistic- just describing the situation as it stands right now- as opposed to using the media to reach a guy who isn't getting the message

GoZAGsMang
11-10-2009, 03:24 PM
For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required
from Luke 12:48.

Bol finally has his shot at the title, and Few just wants him to make the most of it from Few 1:23.

GoZAGsMang

75Zag
11-10-2009, 03:46 PM
Did Moses need a pep-talk before parting the Red Sea?
Did Jesus need a pep-talk before rising from the dead?
Did Lincoln need a pep-talk before the Gettysburg Address?
Did Einstein need a pep-talk before discovering that E=MC2?
Did Jerry Garcia need a pep-talk before founding the Grateful Dead?

So why would Bol need a pep-talk before leading the Zags to victory?

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

GoZAGsMang
11-10-2009, 04:03 PM
I think all of those but one needed and probably got a pep talk.

Moses for instance, had plenty of pep talks and he was pretty tough already.


GoZAGsMang

Baldwinzag
11-10-2009, 04:06 PM
Did Moses need a pep-talk before parting the Red Sea?
Did Jesus need a pep-talk before rising from the dead?
Did Lincoln need a pep-talk before the Gettysburg Address?
Did Einstein need a pep-talk before discovering that E=MC2?
Did Jerry Garcia need a pep-talk before founding the Grateful Dead?

So why would Bol need a pep-talk before leading the Zags to victory?

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

:lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Zag365
11-10-2009, 04:45 PM
I think the comments made by Coach Few say a lot about our team this year and the expectations they must have for this squad.

They must be working their tail off, giving a ton of effort/heart, and pretty darn talented to boot.

I admire Coach Few for calling out Bol, b/c he wants every single player, especially our most gifted, to play hard at all times and reach their potential or else they won't play this season. This is all great news, IMO. Bol will be just fine and, if anything, this is a compliment to the rest of the team.


BaldwinZ: My reaction was same as yours. I don't know Coach Few and, from Seattle vantage point, we rarely see him interviewed or quoted; but, he seems pretty self-disciplined and doesn't go off on players in emotional ways or to shift blame. He is pretty surgical and strategic when he says something in public. He comes across as objective and consistent -- play by his rules and you get playing time. Remember, he hasn't said BK isn't capable, just that he's not there yet. I also like the fact that he's little more public about it in this case because it's showing respect for the rest of the team and is displaying public confidence in his own judgment.

Given the hype surrounding BK, he might also be trying to avoid any rumors or speculation as to why BK may not be seeing as much as action initially as some thought. He's made it clear -- if you don't see a lot of BK at first, it is because others earned their time. Nothing more and nothing less.

Nevtelen
11-11-2009, 09:58 AM
Please, if you get the chance, a little more clarification might help. I have always taken the phrase "put up or shut up" to imply a malcontent or a lot complaining going on. Is that the case here? Or did you mean it more in the sense of Bol needing to grab his lunch pail and get to work? These carry different connotations, one of which is (whether true or untrue) potentially damaging to his character.

As for Few's comments, I'm relieved by the actual quote, because I took it more as Few being pragmatic and realistic- just describing the situation as it stands right now- as opposed to using the media to reach a guy who isn't getting the message

Apologies for not responding faster - (fairly) new baby in the house can be a major time sink!

First off, I'm certainly not an insider, so anything I have to say reacts to the same info 99% of the people on here have, not anything special. 2nd - I just posted that on my lunch brake and the words are more reflective of me typing too fast while trying to probably do too many things at once rather than any intention on my part.

Restated, my opinion is that after all the difficulty and stress and work that Bol went through to get into this country so he could play D-I ball, now is not the time for him to be soft and retiring. I'm sure it is very stressfull playing against the best compeition of your life while adjusting to a new environment, but 8 other guys are doing the same and Bol needs to figure it out, for the good of the team and for his own benefit as well.

Few is pretty honest, but judicious in his use of the press. I doubt he would have made those comments unless he felt he needed to for some reason re Bol. My guess is he's tried motivating him already behind the scenes and feels this might work better. But a guess is all it is.

Anyway, I don't honestly expect Bol to make a major contribution before mid-season anyway, with his lack of organized ball in the recent past. Still, I hope by the WCC season he starts seeing some time.

ronh_pm
11-11-2009, 10:09 AM
As much as every coach would like it, not every player achieves success on the court the same way. Some players have a practice ethic that borders on obsession, others, well not so much.

"I mean listen, we’re sitting here talking about practice, not a game, not a game, not a game, but we’re talking about practice. Not the game that I go out there and die for and play every game like it’s my last but we’re talking about practice man. How silly is that? … Now I know that I’m supposed to lead by example and all that but I’m not shoving that aside like it don’t mean anything. I know it’s important, I honestly do but we’re talking about practice. We’re talking about practice man. We’re talking about practice. We’re talking about practice. We’re not talking about the game. We’re talking about practice"

bballbeachbum
11-11-2009, 10:12 AM
Did Moses need a pep-talk before parting the Red Sea?
Did Jesus need a pep-talk before rising from the dead?
Did Lincoln need a pep-talk before the Gettysburg Address?
Did Einstein need a pep-talk before discovering that E=MC2?
Did Jerry Garcia need a pep-talk before founding the Grateful Dead?

So why would Bol need a pep-talk before leading the Zags to victory?

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

:lmao: perhaps Jerry did not need inspiration, altho he most certainly utilized many anyway

originalcalzag
11-11-2009, 11:22 AM
I am with Bronc on this one. It reminds me of my career in a strange way. If I had a performance issue with an employee, I would never do this in front of somebody else. It was always done behind closed doors. My concern is that this kid now has to face these issues with the fans. There is a chance that he could respond and a chance that he could get on a plane back to BC, which would be very sad. Don't know the details, but this should have been worked out without the media. Confidence is a HUGE part of basketball. Let's hope it does not put him on the less-confident side.

Cal

Bogozags
11-11-2009, 11:55 AM
Motivation comes from within and there are times in our lives when an external source may well be needed to initiate the “adrenalin” to kick-start an individual. In my younger years, this method proved very effective in getting the ball rolling.

Let me begin by stating the obvious: Coach Few is an excellent coach; he has tremendous respect of his peers; and he is a superb teacher, parental figurehead and mentor. As a coach he has been around hundreds of players, most of which are self-starters and some might have required an external "push." He has enormous experience in using various methods to instill motivation, some of which are outside the boundaries of the court. IMO this is just one of the methods to motivate BK.

From all the video I’ve seen, this young man is the real deal and Coach Few wants him ready, willing and able, when that first whistle blows Saturday PM. Coach Few is just as anxious as we are to see the "real" BK "wheel and deal" on the court.

Let’s just hope that BK “finds his way” sooner than later. When he does, we will see exactly why Coach Few was so patient in his recruitment of BK. If he is healthy, his Christening is Saturday and I long to see him on the court!

I am just so excited and know these true/redshirt freshmen are going to have an exceptional season and surprise most observers of college bball.

CDC84
11-11-2009, 01:47 PM
Wonder if the issue has been discussed numerous times "behind closed doors" and the player continues to not respond appropriately? You can't fire the player. Do you remove his scholarship? Seems to me that another tactic should be used first.

This isn't the first time that Few has done this. He's done it several times during his coaching career. It doesn't shock me whatsoever. He went out to the Spokesman-Review during Raivio's senior year and ripped him to shreds for his lack of mental toughness. D-Rav responded by leading the Zags to the WCC regular season and postseason titles.

All players have it within their capacity to play hard at all times, listen to their coaches, and fight thru the minor aches and pains that come with being an athlete at the D-1 level. Bol Kong can't control his rustiness, his unfamiliarity with the Gonzaga offensive system, etc. But he has control over the things Coach Few discussed in that radio interview.

As Robert Sacre has been saying publicly, the guys on the team are wanting to get back to the mentality of the guys 10 years ago. Bouldin has said publicly that he's tired of the primadonna attitudes. These guys are going to have to work for everything this year, and they can't afford to have anyone on the roster fouling up the air.

zag67
11-11-2009, 02:45 PM
So Rohn_hn, I will agree that we are talking about practice. But if you cannot beat your own players in PRACTICE and you do not know the defensive or offensive sets (so that during the games they come naturally), because it was only practice, then do not look for playing anything but garbage time. In most cases, the people that Bol will be practicing against are those that he has to be able to beat consistently if he plans on making it to the next level (and from what we have read, that is something that he and previous coaches think is possible). I think that Few is trying to get him to understand that athletic ability gets you so far, but to get to the next level you need to get better (and this is through practice). This is because all of players in the pros have an athletic ability that is almost as good (or better) as his and they have worked to improve the areas that they were weak in. If he does not do it, then he will have problems.
If a player plans on making it to the next level, practice is the only way that he is going to improve enough to get there is through good coaching and practicing what he is taught. I have watched many great 7 -8 grade players that have everything going for them, but do not even make it to the college level (or end up at a lower division). That is because most of them think that they are good enough that they do not need to practice. They almost always have some offensive, defensive, or rebounding flaws that need to be improved to be a better player at the next level. IMO, I think that this is what the coaching staff is trying to get through to him. I hope they do and that he reaches the potential that many people were predicting.

roxdoc
11-11-2009, 02:57 PM
The message that Few is sending may be more to the fans than Kong - don't count on your wild expectations/predictions to come about any time soon.

BobZag
11-11-2009, 03:06 PM
I've said it before... Give Bol a year. He's a Juco transfer and it takes a while.

I advise patience, all ye jedi.

Jakester425
11-11-2009, 03:07 PM
The message that Few is sending may be more to the fans than Kong - don't count on your wild expectations/predictions to come about any time soon.

I dont think this is the case. Most people outside of this board have no clue who Bol Kong is. Hopefully everything works out.

dim4sum
11-11-2009, 03:20 PM
Long before, and even after becoming the Wizard of Westwood and all the deification and sanctification that comes with becoming an icon, Johnny Wooden would routinely bad mouth his own players. He would routinely look at reporters with his cold blue eyes and state, "We can't win with X in the lineup." Then he would proceed to bad mouth Y,Z and W with the same finality. Whatever the psychology, it seemed to work. Nowadays it's the stuff of law suits, with cry babies whining that the coach held them up to ridicule and destroyed their self- esteem.

titopoet
11-11-2009, 03:31 PM
Reading these posts is funny. Coach Few made some straight comments about Bol, and the flood broke here. There is talk about the breakdown of society due to not being tough enough. There is bad theology about pep talks. (isn't that what prayer is?) (What was the night at Garden of Gethsemane for Jesus, but pep talk?) Jerry Garcia as an idol of toughness? There is talk of firing Bol, whatever that means. I think Bob is right, it is going to take a year to get Bol up to speed. But to use a theological term this board has been so manichean. Either he is the next Michael Jordon, or the worst player in the world. He is in between those two extremes. Again Bob is right.

GUCrew24
11-11-2009, 03:47 PM
Did Moses need a pep-talk before parting the Red Sea?
Did Jesus need a pep-talk before rising from the dead?
Did Lincoln need a pep-talk before the Gettysburg Address?
Did Einstein need a pep-talk before discovering that E=MC2?
Did Jerry Garcia need a pep-talk before founding the Grateful Dead?

So why would Bol need a pep-talk before leading the Zags to victory?

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

Did the USA need a pep talk when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no! :)

Reborn
11-11-2009, 03:51 PM
One of the biggest parts of the Zag's philosophy is that the team is only as good as it's weakest link. I think you could also say the team is as good as all of the links put together. You can not have one link not being it's greatest self. The idea of someone not having to pratice hard, but only play hard in games is pure BS, in my opinion. And I really can't think of any great coach who would allow that on his/her team. We know Few is a great coach, and I feel totally supportive of what he is doing. I also have a gut feeling that there is much more to this story than has been told. We fans know so little, most of the time about what goes on behind closed doors. And it should be that way. This is obviously a motivating technique, and that is its purpose. Should Few use it? Of course. It's part of his job to motivate his players, and Mark Few knows Bol Kong more than any of us, and he's much, much closer to the situation. I think Kong has been through a lot in his life. Really a lot. He's been through a lot in the last two years. He has a story that is inspiring. I believe he will get through whatever he is going through, with the help of Mark Few, his staff and players. The Zags are a family. I think it might be best for us to cool our engines a bit, and zip up all this criticism that always seems to hit this boared when there is ever something that someone needs to turn into a major crisis. I really think some of you people need to get a life.

NotoriousZ
11-11-2009, 03:54 PM
Did the USA need a pep talk when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no! :)

Fantastic first post. LMAO

JPtheBeasta
11-11-2009, 04:21 PM
Few said in answer to Bol's status:

"yeah, he spraind his ankle, (then) he hurt his other leg. He's gotta compete and if he can't fight through it and compete, the bus is gonna leave.

"And that's what's happening. We're not in ymca ball where we all get equal time.

"He's a great kid but there's competition and if your not competing, guys are passing you by. He's now on the outside looking in.

"He's gotta play with a little discomfort & pain, because right now others are ahead of him."



I kinda wonder what Few SHOULD have said here. If he hadn't said anything we would all be wondering what was going on with Bol and why this much heralded prospect is not getting minutes over someone like, I don't know, Gibbs. I think immediately of the blame Josh got for lack of drive when he was secretly playing with an injured foot. IMO, Few is just answering the question presented.

Bol:
1) Is a "great kid"
2) Got hurt. Twice.
3) Wasn't able to play as a result
4) Is in a competition for minutes
5) Has been unable to compete for said minutes
6) Is now behind his teammates in development and playing time

At face value Few's statments are fair. I think you have to read into it to get the negative sentiments or a "calling out" of Bol. Few said Bol needs to play to get minutes. And if he is in pain, then (if follows that) he must play through pain. He didn't say Bol is refusing to play through pain. An insider at the scrimmage said he was playing soft. That could be the result of injury(ies). Or maybe he is just soft. Time will tell. I don't see anywhere where Bol's character is being questioned. Except maybe by us on the board. I don't know what kind of player Bol is, but I will know why he isn't getting minutes in these first couple games.

I like the message Few is sending to the rest of the team. It seems that hard work and good performances will be rewarded. It's a different sport, but I read a recent article blaming the losing skid of the SF 49ers on the signing of rookie hold-out Crabtree. The management compromised on the "team-first" ideals they have been preaching to their team for a guy exhibiting "me-first" behaviors, and they have lost them mentally- so the theory goes, the team quit. I am definitely not implying that Bol is a Crabtree, but I would hate to see Bol get minutes over someone that has been playing well and putting in the work at risk of losing the rest of the team.

ID ZAGFAN
11-11-2009, 04:25 PM
it was the Japanese who bombed Pearl Harbor!

ID ZAGFAN

FlyZag
11-11-2009, 04:32 PM
it was the Japanese who bombed Pearl Harbor!

ID ZAGFAN

It's from animal house :D

Ziggy
11-11-2009, 04:43 PM
It's from animal house :D

Are you dating yourself FZ?

Nevtelen
11-11-2009, 04:53 PM
I kinda wonder what Few SHOULD have said here. If he hadn't said anything we would all be wondering what was going on with Bol and why this much heralded prospect is not getting minutes over someone like, I don't know, Gibbs. I think immediately of the blame Josh got for lack of drive when he was secretly playing with an injured foot. IMO, Few is just answering the question presented.

Bol:
1) Is a "great kid"
2) Got hurt. Twice.
3) Wasn't able to play as a result
4) Is in a competition for minutes
5) Has been unable to compete for said minutes
6) Is now behind his teammates in development and playing time

At face value Few's statments are fair. I think you have to read into it to get the negative sentiments or a "calling out" of Bol. Few said Bol needs to play to get minutes. And if he is in pain, then (if follows that) he must play through pain. He didn't say Bol is refusing to play through pain. An insider at the scrimmage said he was playing soft. That could be the result of injury(ies). Or maybe he is just soft. Time will tell. I don't see anywhere where Bol's character is being questioned. Except maybe by us on the board. I don't know what kind of player Bol is, but I will know why he isn't getting minutes in these first couple games.


I disagree. I think Few's statements pretty clearly are calling Bol out and you really don't have to read into them at all to get that. If it had been a simple injury that had prevented him from playing, period, then Few would have said something more along the lines of, "Well, he's been injured a bit but he'll get working again soon and we're confident he'll be fine," etc etc. Instead Few said, "...if he can't fight through it and compete, the bus is gonna leave." No question to me that is VERY clearly calling out Kong to step up because his own choices are keeping him from getting PT.

SunDevilGolfZag
11-11-2009, 04:55 PM
Few said what he said, but this board should quit crucifying the kid. All of us who actually played sports know the one that "you know you're in trouble when the coach quits yelling at you." Sounds like Few hasn't quit yelling; he's just beginning. IMO, its time to chill out and let the kid make his way without critricism from the peanut gallery.

sonuvazag
11-11-2009, 04:56 PM
Required Animal House viewing:
Short Version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8lT1o0sDwI)
Long Version (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q47bpOCTcaY&feature=related)

Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

BobZag
11-11-2009, 05:02 PM
Time, people. Time.

ronh_pm
11-11-2009, 05:14 PM
So Rohn_hn, I will agree that we are talking about practice. But if you cannot beat your own players in PRACTICE and you do not know the defensive or offensive sets (so that during the games they come naturally), because it was only practice, then do not look for playing anything but garbage time.....

Ok..Found a soapbox.

To get this thread back on track all that has been reported was that Few said

"yeah, he spraind his ankle, (then) he hurt his other leg. He's gotta compete and if he can't fight through it and compete, the bus is gonna leave.

"And that's what's happening. We're not in ymca ball where we all get equal time.

"He's a great kid but there's competition and if your not competing, guys are passing you by. He's now on the outside looking in.

"He's gotta play with a little discomfort & pain, because right now others are ahead of him."

First off, all I hear are Few calling Bol out to be tougher and play through what he (Few) considers being minor injuries, as by the sounds of it, other players have done exactly that.

Now, if I were going to extrapolate anything more, which I shouldn't as reading words on a page makes it extremely hard to gauge what the actual "hidden message" was, (if any) it would not be that Bol has to learn sets, work harder, learn how to beat people in practice or anything else of that nature.

It would be that Bol has to learn that this team, unlike every other team Bol has played for in recent memory, does not revolve around him. He is no longer a star and the sooner that Bol realizes this, the better it will be for Bol. And the better things are for Bol, the better things are for Gonzaga.

Though I know not of his practice history, Bol may well have gotten away with “coach I'm a little sore today, I'm just going to shoot 12 point until my ankle feels better" at high school and junior college. I would say Coach Few is having none of that now.

As the "primadonna" word came up earlier in the thread one could suppose that this is Few's way of telling us that Bol is not a primadonna and is not going to be treated as such. If I was extrapolating correctly I would be quite sure that he has had this talk with Bol already.

Now to pile another soapbox on top of the one I am on and completely talk off the top of my head.

What could get quite interesting is if when Bol does get his diminished minutes, he is able to produce. A coach has no favor for a primadonna but even worse for a coach I would think, is a primadonna that produces.

What to do?

Better to have the primadonna in his (proper) place before it ever gets to that point.

As I leap off my soapbox I can easily say I (for the minute amount that it matters) have no reservations whatsoever about Bol's character, work ethic and ability, I think it just his role on the team that is in question right now.

Here's to a long enjoyable season.

Cheers.

BobZag
11-11-2009, 05:27 PM
Few's words could be a sublimal message--coded of course--to all military veterans. In fact, I just deciphered his message!

"Thank you, Men and Women in the Armed Forces! Happy Veterans Day!"

MickMick
11-11-2009, 06:24 PM
Maybe Few's message was directed at the fans more than Bol?

In other words, Bol isn't going to immediatley contribute as much as many of us expected. Instead of Few explaining after the fact, a warning before hand?

Maybe Bol needs a little time to catch up? Maybe he needs to practice a little more?

More than anything, maybe this is more about the other players exceeding expectations as opposed to Bol not meeting them.

The rest of the group are picking things up quickly and have earned the playing time. They have passed Bol by. That doesn't mean that Bol will not pick things up. It doesn't mean that Bol will not be a great player. It just means that Bol nursing an ankle has given others an opportunity....and they have siezed upon it.

zag67
11-11-2009, 06:36 PM
MickMick, I agree that it might have been aimed at us. I would assume that he has already talked to Bol multiple times and that they recognize that he is not going to be super productive this year. I also agree with BZ, that this will be his year to grow and then next year will be the year to show.

vandalzag
11-11-2009, 06:49 PM
Maybe coach Few was saying that if the grass is wet do not walk on the sidewalk

JAGzag
11-11-2009, 06:58 PM
We should let Few coach and give this kid a break. NONE of us are there in practice and I can't begin to imagine what Bol's adjustment must be like. Just give him some time.

MickMick
11-11-2009, 08:17 PM
Coach Few must have a difficult time choosing who will contribute the most. When it comes to splitting hairs, the smallest of things can work for or against you.

JPtheBeasta
11-11-2009, 08:33 PM
I disagree. I think Few's statements pretty clearly are calling Bol out and you really don't have to read into them at all to get that. If it had been a simple injury that had prevented him from playing, period, then Few would have said something more along the lines of, "Well, he's been injured a bit but he'll get working again soon and we're confident he'll be fine," etc etc. Instead Few said, "...if he can't fight through it and compete, the bus is gonna leave." No question to me that is VERY clearly calling out Kong to step up because his own choices are keeping him from getting PT.

I understand why you and others think that. I think a coach is treading in dangerous waters any time he/she decides to mention a specific player in this sort of situation to the media. I guess I just tend to look at the half-full glass of Kool Aid that Pollyanna gave me with rose-colored glasses.

TheZagPhish
11-11-2009, 08:40 PM
I guess I just tend to look at the half-full glass of Kool Aid that Pollyanna gave me with rose-colored glasses.

Dude, she gets around quite a bit in here. Just sayin'. Be careful.

MickMick
11-11-2009, 08:56 PM
Dude, she gets around quite a bit in here. Just sayin'. Be careful.

Nothing wrong with embracing the players. Who wouldn't want any of the players (including Bol) to be successful?

If it is too early to judge the team, it is definitely to early to pass judgement on a player.

TheZagPhish
11-11-2009, 09:11 PM
Nothing wrong with embracing the players. Who wouldn't want any of the players (including Bol) to be successful?

If it is too early to judge the team, it is definitely to early to pass judgement on a player.

Just serving crepes, MM.

This team makes me happier than a little tree in a Bob Ross painting.

zagbapi
11-11-2009, 10:26 PM
Apparently all UW cares about is $$.

Hate to burst your bubble but the $$ is the bottom line and prime motivator for most of the schools! A team does well, we watch, we spend, we support.
Waiting for your neg rep now but I for one am not drinking the koolaid, BK will get there I'm sure of it...

MEZAG
11-11-2009, 11:16 PM
Are you dating yourself FZ?


Can't date yourself quoting or referring the timeless masterpiece that is Animal House.

MickMick
11-12-2009, 03:38 AM
Just serving crepes, MM.

This team makes me happier than a little tree in a Bob Ross painting.

And to quote Bob Ross

"There are no mistakes, just happy accidents" :)

seasontixholder
11-12-2009, 04:56 AM
Maybe coach Few was saying that if the grass is wet do not walk on the sidewalk

Amen and +1. What Few said was the truth and perfectly in the circle of reasonable comments. Some posters here are wound so tight that they are arguing with 100 years of sports maxims, in order to be PC and "protect" hurt feelings. You can post the most vanilla sports adages, and someone will jump in order to protected the presumed pride of a creampuff they imagine to exist. It says a lot about the poster and the present culture of Oprah.

frontrangezag
11-12-2009, 06:47 AM
I seems like ever year there is an animal house "Germans bombed Pearl Harbor" reference. I love it because someone always posts that it was the Japanese.

Now I am ready for basketball.