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BobZag
11-05-2009, 10:50 AM
It's a "bridge" year, a bridge to get the Zags from last year's Sweet Sixteen team (Coulda woulda shoulda been EE if anybody but Heels in SS) to next year's team (imagine all these frosh as sophs)... But while bridging 2008-09 to 2010-11, some very good things could happen, ie, win Maui, upset Duke, win a few big games (Okie, Illini, WF, Memphis), win the WCC, etc. So by no means am I writing off this year's Zags, no way... I'm just saying next year the Zags should be better and the year after next year should even be better, and dare I say in three years when all these frosh are juniors and seniors we fans could be watching a Zag team of all Zag teams.

Not many teams will have frontcourts as good as a RS senior Sacre and juniors Olynyk and Poling with RS soph Dower. Not many teams will have backcourts as good as senior Meech and Kong and juniors Vilarino and Arop and Gibbs, and any new guards like Dranginis/Bell and an unforeseen transfer.

Anyhooo, that's kinda how I view this team this season, and teams of the future at Gonzaga.

You?

Zerogame
11-05-2009, 11:11 AM
Bob, what planet are you on. Few and company got a bunch of no-names; they are not even mentioned on Rivals, etc. You can’t win like that. We know Few can’t coach, we got no talent. If we can’t get those Burger Boys we got no chance, not now, not ever.





I know, just being an A**. It will be exciting for years to come.

23dpg
11-05-2009, 11:22 AM
This really is the year that the other WCC teams have to think they have a shot at the title. Gonzaga is so inexperienced this year. That being said, I still think GU can do it this year also.

1973Zag
11-05-2009, 11:31 AM
we're doomed. might as well forfeit all our games now. we can't possibly play with the big boys with a bunch of no name rookies. we should just drop basketball as a sport (forgot the sign for sarcasm!)

23dpg
11-05-2009, 11:46 AM
I want the drugs that some of these posters must be on. This team ain't losing a single WCC game. Book it.

I think you're wrong but hope that you're not!.:)

ZagMan in Philly
11-05-2009, 11:56 AM
I would be happy if this team can win the WCC, WCC tournament, and oh yes BEAT Duke!

Pleasant Peninsula
11-05-2009, 12:03 PM
This team ain't losing a single WCC game. Book it.

Werd.

26-5. #4 seed in the tournament. Sweet 16 birth.

At least.

This team is going to be good, folks.

GUBoardsAreCrazy
11-05-2009, 12:29 PM
I'm terrified that, for the first time in over a decade, this team MIGHT be in rebuilding mode. That being said, this is the time for guys like Sacre, Meech, and Gray to step up and fill the shoes of Pargo, Heytvelt, and Downs. At the end of the year, they could be saying "With all the talent GU lost, this was supposed to be the rebulding year, but they once again, reloaded." Or they could be saying "The Zags will be absolutely GREAT in a year or two." I'm hoping the former.. But I am TERRIFIED!

CDC84
11-05-2009, 12:50 PM
This really is the year that the other WCC teams have to think they have a shot at the title. Gonzaga is so inexperienced this year. That being said, I still think GU can do it this year also.

The problem is that the WCC is going to be worse than it has been in several seasons - so Gonzaga's inexperience might not matter as much as it normally would. Several preseason magazines like TSN's have mentioned this. I would be very concerned if this year's GU team had to battle for the WCC title with the kind of club St. Mary's had last season. I mean, I think Portland is going to be tough, but the Pilots still have a whole lot of question marks going into this year despite their experience. For one thing, they have yet to prove they can consistently win on the road. Also, while I like some of their players and I love their coach, they don't have a major talent like a Diamon Simpson or a Patty Mills on their roster. That being said, I don't expect an unblemished conference record from Gonzaga this year.

If this year's GU team can win the WCC regular season crown and win enough non-league games to allow themselves some NCAA tournament wiggle room in case they get beat in Vegas, it will basically prove my theory that Gonzaga's program is at a state where it no longer rebuilds but retools. Programs that experience "retooling years" (or as BZ likes to put it, "bridge years") still win a lot of games and enjoy a good deal of success even if their best years are ahead of them. Rebuilding teams don't make the NCAA tournament and sometimes have more losses than wins.

Baldwinzag
11-05-2009, 12:52 PM
I would be happy if this team can win the WCC, WCC tournament, and oh yes BEAT Duke!

Yep. If this team managed to go 1-29 with the one win being against Duke, I'd still consider the season a success! ;)

All kidding aside, there is no doubt this team is going to surprise people and most likely perform better than expected. However, I think many are underestimating experience, plain and simple. While this team will outperform many apects compared to last years team--rebounding for one--I have a feeling our offense won't be as fluid and crisp overall. When you consider how offensively gifted players such as Pargo, Heytvelt, Daye, Downs, and Bouldin were & still are, then you realize it'll be tough for our offensive production to recover after losing nearly every starter in the same year. Just look how dominating each one of these player are on the European circuit, they are all averaging 15+ pts per game, including Heytvelt.

This year's squad is young and definitely not last year's team. Listen to Coach Few and Co., it takes a good year or two to entirely grasp the complexity of this offense and they've been required to cut out nearly half the playbook to accomodate the new-comers. They are being developed slowly but surely. Seven FRESHMAN have just arrived and there will be growing pains. Heck, if we're within 20 pts vs MSU, I'd consider it a success so early on in the year. And that's OK, because we have a very high ceiling as Mal has eluded to. By the end of the season, and especially next, we will be a force to reckon with. We all know that, so enjoy this season's mini-accomplishments. I have a feeling its going to be the most enjoyable season we've seen in a longtime. It'll be Bouldin's SR campaign, very little expectations, and watching the development of very talented freshman whom are ready, willing, and eager to make an impact. I plan to be patient and let this team grow. I'd suggest celebrating the small stuff this year i.e. hustle, hard work, improving every game, playing with heart, close games, maybe even an "upset".

Lastly, there is a very small chance, if any, we'll go undefeated in WCC. I'm not being negative, just realistic. I have expectations for this team, but going undefeated in conference isn't one of them. Remember, St. Mary's is receiving the Top-3 ranked players in all of Australia(one being an NBA prospect), Portland returning the entire starting ten, and LMU being vastly underrated with high-profile prospects and transfers. I predict between 7-9 losses, another 22+ wins, and making it to WCC Championship game. Beyond that, it's be all gravy...

Larrylegend
11-05-2009, 01:23 PM
A college basketball team's most important position is the point guard. A great point guard leads his team and is the engine powering the offense while also the first line of defense on the other end of the floor. NCAA championship teams nearly always have a great point guard.

I am hopeful Meech makes the big freshman--sophomore leap. Bouldin may be GU's star player but the key to this year's team is Meech.

NotoriousZ
11-05-2009, 02:18 PM
Really loving your posts this year, Malastein.

BobZag
11-05-2009, 02:20 PM
Mal, I don't disagree and I'm not predicting doom by any stretch. The guys will surprise us fans this year. The frontcourt already looks strong. You don't get 63 rebounds with half of them offensive if the frontcourt is weak, I don't care if you're playing the Sisters of the Poor. I see some very nice things happening this year.

It's just that, the way I see it--

2009-10 = A good team
2010-11 = A really good team
2011-12 = A special team
2012-13 = A really special team

Of course, some of this progression depends on variables like recruiting success, chemistry, health, hard work, transfers, etc.

bartruff1
11-05-2009, 03:17 PM
I want the drugs that some of these posters must be on. This team ain't losing a single WCC game. Book it....I hope it is me...:confused:

zag67
11-05-2009, 03:35 PM
Mal, I also agree with you. I also think that some people are missing how strong we are with "experienced" guards. Matt, Meech, Steven and Gibbs (even though he redshirted, he has had a year to watch the offensive and defensive sets). This will help stabalize the team by cutting down the turnovers. Then at the power/post we have Poling, Sacred and Foster. These again should bring some stability to the rebounding and defensive sets. Therefore I see these players bringing about many wins during the early part of the season.

Now you throw in the wildcards of all of the athletic ability that our new players will bring to the table, then this should help us win one, two or ????? more games. Lastly as the year goes on (IF THEY CAN KEEP THE CHEMISTRY), these new players will integrate with the existing players and the team will be stronger and better. This will lead to winning the league and then the tournament (I hope........).

75Zag
11-05-2009, 03:36 PM
I would love to see the Bulldogs kick some hind end against Michigan State, win the Maui tournament and carry the momentum into a win at Madison Square Garden. But as a card carrying member of the reality-based-community, I have absolutely no idea how the Bulldogs will do until I see them on the court a few times against top 25 competition. If they slap the big boys around I will be as excited as anybody. Looking forward to the season.

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

BobZag
11-05-2009, 04:02 PM
These multitudes of frosh are like two-year-old thoroughbreds being taught how to start out of the gate, how to take turns, how to change leads, how to pace themselves, and all the other things trainers must teach a racehorse. Plus, they're still growing, filling out, maturing...

Next year the frosh become sophs which is akin to a racehorse becoming derby age, three. They mature into bigger, stronger, faster, more powerful equines, but they're still colts and still room for improvement.

Then they become juniors and seniors and, like racehorses, they're now cagey veterans compared to their days as two-year-olds. Colts become horses when they're four. They're even bigger, faster and stronger than they were before. And smarter.

Anyway, as analogies go, that's how I see it with the current frosh.

And that just means the team gets better and better over the next few years. If this team can be as a good this year, as Mal suggests, then watch out next year and beyond.

DADoZAG
11-05-2009, 04:11 PM
Anyway, as analogies go, that's how I see it with the current frosh.

And that just means the team gets better and better over the next few years. If this team can be as a good this year, as Mal suggests, then watch out next year and beyond.

Ahhh, the other half of the glass, the upper half, tastes so sweet. Why would anyone only spend so much time on the lower, boring half?

Assuming these colts all stay full term, it will be fun!

Go ZAGS!

MickMick
11-05-2009, 04:27 PM
I have to agree with Mal on at least one point. I think this team will be better than the team last year.

For no other reason than rebounding. They will not score from every position as consistently, but they will certainly get many more second chance points. The misses will not be nearly as painful. The perimeter shooter will gain confidence watching their misses become put backs.

And Zag nation will no longer hold their collective breath every time someone launches a ball from the three point line. They will know that a miss isn't an automatic change of possession.

Baldwinzag
11-05-2009, 04:27 PM
These multitudes of frosh are like two-year-old thoroughbreds being taught how to start out of the gate, how to take turns, how to change leads, how to pace themselves, and all the other things trainers must teach a racehorse. Plus, they're still growing, filling out, maturing...

Next year the frosh become sophs which is akin to a racehorse becoming derby age, three. They mature into bigger, stronger, faster, more powerful equines, but they're still colts and still room for improvement.

Then they become juniors and seniors and, like racehorses, they're now cagey veterans compared to their days as two-year-olds. Colts become horses when they're four. They're even bigger, faster and stronger than they were before. And smarter.

Anyway, as analogies go, that's how I see it with the current frosh.

And that just means the team gets better and better over the next few years. If this team can be as a good this year, as Mal suggests, then watch out next year and beyond.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/__jFgOqdirRY/Sp_3nME9y0I/AAAAAAAACkc/j0YBZw1s5vg/s400/brilliant_medium.jpg

BobZag
11-05-2009, 04:32 PM
Just watch the difference age and maturation in racehorses this weekend during the Breeders Cup races. It's very noticeable.

tyra
11-05-2009, 04:42 PM
My definition of success this year is winning the conference (however and irrespective of W-L) and getting to The Dance.

My concerns for this year are: 1) Rob staying healthy, and 2) Steven becoming more consistent especially as an outside scorer. I think all the rest, especially the kids learning the system and growing, will come in time. And if my concerns are not realized, then I am looking forward to Success.

seasontixholder
11-05-2009, 04:50 PM
BZ is so right. Seniors are so much different than underclassmen. I took heat last year by predicting excellence, simply because we had so many seniors that were offensively skilled and defensively long. If that same class had been predominantly youngsters with all that potential, I wouldn't have dared to.

Hustle/desire and better passing is what will distinguish this class from last year's. But there are too many substantial questions marks, especially outside shooting quality and center depth defensively.

One last thing. I remember witnessing a close call in the WCC tournament by one of our best teams ever, and to an ugly opponent to boot. It took a miracle to win that game. Going into this year's tournament games, the team will probably be bubblish because of the SOS. There's going to be two games (at least) of pressure, where plain luck might figure. Last year's guys had the combination of offensive shooting ability and defensive length - and experience - in a decent WCC year to control everything. I don't have the trust in this group of youngsters yet. I l-o-v-e the enthusiam and the potential, but there are some unfilled holes yet.

Reborn
11-05-2009, 04:52 PM
I too believe this is a special group of players with loads of talent. I think that this years team will be better than BZ thinks. The chemistry this year is unbelievable. I think that the team has BIG goals. They have characteristics that last years team didn't have, toughness, tenacity, athletic, desire to rebound and play D. I believe that now is the time. It's the only time we have. I say "Go for all of it,now, worry about next year when it comes. I'm a believer in living in he NOW.

BobZag
11-05-2009, 04:56 PM
In closing, I do believe...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmowtt9vhLY

:)

GoZags
11-05-2009, 05:10 PM
In closing, I do believe.,,,

I'll see your close, and I'll raise you one (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lputIMecalw)

Nevtelen
11-05-2009, 07:04 PM
I think the vast majority of Mal's points are good ones, though it's tough to say exactly how accurate without this team ever having taken the floor vs D-I competition (let alone elite D-I competition).

BUT, IMO, I think a lot of those points miss the forest for the trees. The details are correct - this team will almost certainly be an upgrade in the rebounding dept. and the the post play will be tougher, yes. More guys will probably be playing in positions they're suited for rather than having most of them playing out of position like last year's squad often did and that will help in a lot of areas. It's also possible that this edition of the Zags will have a more noticeable toughness and killer instinct - I agree that was lacking at times last season.

Still, though, basketball is a game of details - how and when to set your feet, where to be when, the often minute difference between a charge and a block, when to have your hands up for that bounce pass, how to communicate to switch on a screen. How to avoid foul trouble and play effectively on the floor when you already have too many fouls. I think people overlook the 10,000 things that last year's squad did automatically because they'd been there and done that a hundred times, not to mention their ability to draw on experience when in a tight spot. Rebounds and TOs both result in lost possessions and while this year's team will undoubtedly get more of the former (probably a lot more), they'll also probably have more of the latter (hopefully not a lot more, but we'll see). They probably won't be the #1 % FG defensive squad in the country because they'll need experience together to get there (and unique skill-sets like Daye's inbounds D and fantastic shot-blocks are missing). When Bouldin is getting guarded too tightly and is ineffective on O, where does the team go to? They don't have those team instincts built up yet.

It's human nature to see what is missing and want that. It's easy to look back at last year's team and see what was missing and want those qualities in this years' bunch. We'll probably get a lot of it. But don't overlook what last year's squad was really good at, because they were really good at a lot of things, despite their shortcomings.

For me, I look at this year's team as a total remodelling of the program. But the solid foundation of Few and Co and upperclassmen like Bouldin are there to support and mold a huge group of kids who seem to have major potential to take this program to some fantastic heights a year or two down the road.

This year, we get the enjoyment of seeing the future begin, even if I think it'll be on a rocky road. I hope (and believe) this team can win the WCC and make the Dance. I think it's one and done, but that's okay this season. And hopefully it'll lead to some wonderful things to come.

MickMick
11-05-2009, 07:21 PM
This year, we get the enjoyment of seeing the future begin, even if I think it'll be on a rocky road. I hope (and believe) this team can win the WCC and make the Dance. I think it's one and done, but that's okay this season. And hopefully it'll lead to some wonderful things to come.

No question it will be a rocky road. I can easily live with a one and done. Heck, I can easily live with just making the tournament. I expect Michigan State to whoop on the Zags.

But come March, they are more like sophmores than freshman. I like their potential to match up with the tough teams better than the previous version. They will not have as high of a FG% as last year, but I like everything else about this team.

If Akron and WKU could give the Zags fits last season, there is no doubt in my mind that this year's version could give the 08-09 Zags a handfull as well. This is why I agree with much of what Mal is saying.

SpudDawg
11-05-2009, 08:50 PM
Right on, Nevtelen. Excellent post.

MedZag
11-05-2009, 09:06 PM
There's no denying the talent of this year's squad. That being said, 9 players who have yet to play a regular season DI game is 9 players. I think that we will see flashes of brilliance, but there will be consistency issues. There will be nerves. Probably a few boneheaded mistakes.

I really do not know what to make of this year's squad. I think this team could rattle off a 3 or 4 loss season or finish 2nd in the WCC and neither would surprise me. The reality will, like anything in life, most likely fall somewhere in the middle. But the uncertainty is certainly exciting.

FuManShoes
11-05-2009, 09:19 PM
Last year's team went undefeated in the WCC and reached the Sweet 16 without a true big man or a PG who can shoot. They got ousted by a team that was head and shoulders better than any other team in D-1 and would have beaten anyone that night. Please remind me what the problem was with last year's team and why the ceiling is so much higher for this one.

I appreciate the enthusiasm for this edition of the Zags but am preparing for a long season and a reality check. Call me a grinch. This team has fun names and hairdos but has proven little on the court. The returning players are all skilled in certain ways -- Bouldin is a hell of a combo guard who reminds me plenty of Deron Williams but absolutely disappears in some games against top competition. That cannot happen. Steven Gray is a special threat ala Bouldin but needs to have that three point shot return seeing as this team has few other shooters. Sacre is a rebounding force but has yet to show the ability to stay on the court, protect the ball or finish in the paint. Meech is a speedster and a scrapper but his suspect shooting could be a problem if defenders can simply lay off him. Will has yet to prove he's more than a gadget play. The others? Enigmas. They are either coming off injuries or coming into an unfamiliar system. They offer nice youtube clips and some energized play against lesser competition but are completely inexperienced at this level and being asked to fill some big shoes. Maybe they can do it, but the odds are they won't just role unimpeded to an Elite Eight. And in a season that promises trial by fire, setbacks early could linger. Color me cautious and curious.

mgadfly
11-05-2009, 10:32 PM
By every objective standard last year's team will be better than this year's team. As Mal says, "book it."

Last year's team, led by that stiff Heytvelt and those other no name, no guts, hacks Jeremy Pargo, Micah Downs, and Austin Daye had the best statistical season that a Zag team has had since very early on in this incredible run... 5th in offensive efficiency, 18th in defensive efficiency and 7th overall in the nation by kenpom, but yeah they will be super easy to replace and we won't miss a beat this season with a bunch of new players that have barely played together and haven't been tested against elite competition. Nothing to it, those guys last year didn't deserve to wear GU's uniforms, I mean all they did was make it to the Sweet 16 and lose to the eventual national champions (a team that beat every team they faced in the tournament by double-digits)...


I'm really looking forward to this season, watching a new group of guys build toward a great future, and if they make the tourney anything can happen, but comparing them to last year's team is a bit ... premature.

sonuvazag
11-06-2009, 08:50 AM
Every year across the college landscape there will be a few teams made up of mostly unknowns who will blow everyone socks off and challenge the validity preseason rankings. Gonzaga has been one of those teams many times over the last 15 years and have a chance again this year. I wouldn't rule of the possibility that this team does even better than last year's team, but I'm not seeing it as the most likely outcome.

maineblackbear
11-06-2009, 10:03 AM
our backcourt is stunning this year. our players up front have lots of room to grow. early this season, I expect some L's. WCC should be ours, but young folks can implode and go on two or three week funks . . .my main concern is not talent--there the sky is the limit--but mental stuff--young people tend to have more problems, focus more on them, create similar situations for themselves to fail, creating self-fulfilling prophecies-that is coaching responsibility, but seven frosh . . . wow--lotsa potential for headcases, despite mega-talent.

Fillies become mares at five; colts become horses at five. Hate to disagree with Bobzag when he is being loquacious, but there you go . . .

cjm720
11-06-2009, 12:13 PM
Overall, I think this year's squad has more depth and talent than last year's, which is obviously saying a lot. TO's and free-throw shooting are my primary concerns with this young squad. One turnover is essentailly two buckets for the opposing team, assuming they can convert. If we give up 3-4 extra turnovers a game, it could definitely cost us an extra game or two.

The future is indeed bright though.

go zags!!!!!

Kiddwell
11-06-2009, 12:15 PM
Really Important Qualifications for 2009's newbies:

*KO and Manny are long-time teammates at the Canadian national team level. They don't have to learn to play together. They've been doing so for an extended period now. By playing for Canada they're already tourney tested.
*Elias H. is a German national star who competed against professional talent in Europe. By playing for Germany he's already tourney tested.
*Elias and Bol Kong are 20-somethings (not wide-eyed teens)
*Bol may prove Steven's co-gunslinger this year
*Andy Poling (a national 5-star HS freshman) is strong, genuinely healthy at last, and RS savvy
*Grant Gibbs is RS savvy and may prove the squad's most gritty competitor


This is not your garden variety D1 recruiting class.

By NCAA time, given slight alignment of the stars, this team'll be dangerous, IMHO.

[The above assumes that Sam Dower 'shirts]

Mantua
11-06-2009, 12:24 PM
Overall, I think this year's squad has more depth and talent than last year's, which is obviously saying a lot. TO's and free-throw shooting are my primary concerns with this young squad. One turnover is essentailly two buckets for the opposing team, assuming they can convert. If we give up 3-4 extra turnovers a game, it could definitely cost us an extra game or two.

The future is indeed bright though.

go zags!!!!!

Very well put. Boils it all down realistically.

maynard g krebs
11-06-2009, 12:41 PM
This is not your garden variety D1 recruiting class.

By NCAA time, given slight alignment of the stars, this team'll be dangerous, IMHO.

[The above assumes that Sam Dower 'shirts]

+1

Robzagnut
11-06-2009, 02:47 PM
Give me some o' that Mala Kool Aid!!! Sheesh.


PG: Meech offers the same breakneck speed as Pargo, potentially better defense(I think it was too close to call at the end of last season), much more natural playmaking ability as a true point guard. Pargo is better in the post and at scoring. Meech could be a better outside shooter, and should play more within the offense while being a much better half court set guy. Slight edge-Meech.

Seriously? Meech hasn't started a single game and we have no idea how he's going to perform day in, day out and you give him the edge over a senior whose biggest games came against the toughest teams and a player who was the WCC Player of the Year as a junior?

Meech might do great, he might struggle, he'll have his highs and lows, but NO WAY at this time can you give the edge to Meech.

Rose, tulip, daisy and petunia colored galsses there Mal.



PF: Austin Daye is a great outside shooter with good ballhandling skills, and decent rebounding ability(although he got pushed around by tough forwards). Harris is a unique freshmen in that he is 20 year old who has already played in tough European leagues and for his national team. He's got a knack for rebounding and uses his athleticism to make plays around the basket. He's also able to guard multiple positions. Edge: Harris(although Daye would have the edge as a SF or SG).

You've got to be kidding! Daye is 6' 11" and would have broken the GU blocked shots record if he stayed another year. Daye was a #15 pick in the NBA draft. Where would the 6' 6" Harris go today?... he wouldn't be drafted. If Daye had stayed this year we would have seen the next WCC Player of the Year unfold before our eyes. Harris might win it in a year or two... maybe.

I like the new team and new guys as much as the next, but to rate these new guys higher than their counterparts when they haven't played a single game is just putting a little too much expectations on these guys.

Give them a year, see how they play against MSU, Duke and Memphis, then rate them for next year.

bigblahla
11-06-2009, 03:05 PM
For the doubters, only injuries and more experienced team play will be our nemesis. Talent although unproven should match up with any team in the country and after the Texas scrimmage, a trip to Sparty and then Paradise we'll all have a good idea of what's to come this season.

For the believers, Coach and staff have stolen the keys to the Kingdom. Now they just have to harness that incredible talent and mold it into a cohesive aggressive focused killing machine. WE GOT ATTITUDE!!!!!! Finally...... :D

I loved last years team and agree with many here that we could have gone further had we not faced UNC in the S16.

Is it game time yet?

Go!! Zags!!!

MickMick
11-06-2009, 03:17 PM
After the display last season, we have people concerned about turnovers from this bunch?

How many memorable turnovers does anyone have that came from Meech? Refresh my memory please. There are turnovers and then there are big, big, big turnovers that come at exactly the wrong time.

Then there are big, big, big plays that come at exactly the right time.

bigblahla
11-06-2009, 03:23 PM
After the display last season, we have people concerned about turnovers from this bunch?

How many memorable turnovers does anyone have that came from Meech? Refresh my memory please. There are turnovers and then there are big, big, big turnovers that come at exactly the wrong time.

Then there are big, big, big plays that come at exactly the right time.

That's what you'd call hammering home a point. Gets positive rep from me.

Go !! Zags!!!

Nevtelen
11-06-2009, 05:37 PM
After the display last season, we have people concerned about turnovers from this bunch?

How many memorable turnovers does anyone have that came from Meech? Refresh my memory please. There are turnovers and then there are big, big, big turnovers that come at exactly the wrong time.

Then there are big, big, big plays that come at exactly the right time.

Meech also wasn't in the position to make big TOs last season (except perhaps the WKU game) while others were. This season we have to see what happens when he's in those situations.

Not only that, but a TO can happen on either end of the ball - even with a laser-guided pass, if the guy on the other end isn't ready or looking for it, it's a TO, so it doesn't necessarily all depend only on the PG.

CDC84
11-06-2009, 10:04 PM
I just watched a replay of the Alberta game, and I'm telling you, if these guys play that hard from start to finish in every game this season, it will cover up a lot of freshmen mistakes. Coaches normally have to teach their youngsters to play that hard. Several of these guys just have it in their system.

This is going to be a fun team to watch. Part of the fun is going to be hearing the response of various announcers and pundits when they first see some of these newcomers play. They're going to be in for a surprise. The staff did a heck of a recruiting job.

Reborn
11-07-2009, 05:09 AM
I just watched a replay of the Alberta game, and I'm telling you, if these guys play that hard from start to finish in every game this season, it will cover up a lot of freshmen mistakes. Coaches normally have to teach their youngsters to play that hard. Several of these guys just have it in their system.

CDC: Who were the guys you noticed that played hard from start to finish? I'm really excited to see them play. Radio is better than nothing, but it doesn't even come close to what TV gives us.

zag buddy
11-07-2009, 05:42 AM
One aspect of the new kids that I dearly love is that Pargo used to walk the ball up the court and then look around and finally start a play. Meech brings the ball ball upcourt as fast as any guard I've seen and immediately passes to start the play.I love it! Go zags.

JPtheBeasta
11-07-2009, 09:16 AM
One aspect of the new kids that I dearly love is that Pargo used to walk the ball up the court and then look around and finally start a play. Meech brings the ball ball upcourt as fast as any guard I've seen and immediately passes to start the play.I love it! Go zags.

I like that, too. Do you remember when we had Stepp running things? I don't know how many times Ronny beat his guy up the court for a lob or an easy post-up. Meech's style should result in some easy baskets in the early offense. It can cover up some of the short comings in knowing the offensive system early on, as well. I don't see how Samhan, for example, will be able to consistantly keep up with our athletic bigs for an entire game. And it should slow him down on his end of the court as well. The Zags have the experience in the guard core and the depth and athleticism down low to really make the up-tempo thing work, IMO.

MickMick
11-07-2009, 09:33 AM
I like that, too. Do you remember when we had Stepp running things? I don't know how many times Ronny beat his guy up the court for a lob or an easy post-up. Meech's style should result in some easy baskets in the early offense. It can cover up some of the short comings in knowing the offensive system early on, as well. I don't see how Samhan, for example, will be able to consistantly keep up with our athletic bigs for an entire game. And it should slow him down on his end of the court as well. The Zags have the experience in the guard core and the depth and athleticism down low to really make the up-tempo thing work, IMO.

We are experiencing the same visions.

Nice post.

azzagfan
11-07-2009, 11:17 AM
I try to be both optimistic and realistic when I comment on the board, but the only edge this team might hold on last year's team is heart and desire. That makes up for a lot, but I think last year's team could win a lot of games on down days (and did). This team will not have that luxury.

Our starting 5 last year had all 5 starters and the top sub that could hurt you from 3 (Pargo being the least likely to do so, but he was streaky). We ran out lineups of everyone 6'5" or taller. We were a matchup nightmare. We had weaknesses, but they were weaknesses that 97% of coaches in the NCAA would have traded their weaknesses for in a heartbeat. We had a rare combination of size and athleticism. On several occasions, colleagues at work and stop by and say, "I watched the Zags last night, and they are very, very good."

I hope this team tears it up (and they are likely better than some pundits are predicting), and I feel they may have the heart and desire thing back closer to some of the Zag teams I've loved, but if we're simply talking size, skill, athleticism, experience...we should all be realistic.

MickMick
11-07-2009, 12:05 PM
Teamwork, basketball IQ, a will to win. I'll take that over a collection of individual superstars any day. Those attributes + great athletes = UNC last year.

If I wanted to watch a collection of super talented individuals that don't play as a team, I would buy tickets for the McDonald's All American game.

To many fans, basketball is much more than a continuous high lite reel.

TheBunnieRancher
11-07-2009, 02:01 PM
Given the right circumstances, the sum of the whole can be much greater than the sum of the parts. Experience definitely plays an important part in bringing that to the forefront. Last years team had lots of experience and this one doesn't. Even though the second 5 off the bench may be better athletes than the starters, you need to give them a break and give them the chance to gain some valuable experience working through the highs and lows this season will bring. I believe this is the point BZ is trying to convey. That being said, it is interesting that main common link between both teams (Matt Bouldin) seems to be much more enthusiastic about this group.

bartruff1
11-07-2009, 02:22 PM
I'm throwing this season out there under Bill Simmons' Ewing Theory. The team will be better after Heytvelt, Daye, Pargo, and Downs have left. Might not seem like it to the casual fan, but there's real potential for it. And yes, I'm excited deep into Gonzaga's future. This class should be called the Elusive Eight(even considering potential redshirts) because nobody knows how good they really are going to be.Have your perscriptions checked...

LynetteG
11-07-2009, 03:29 PM
Mal, I'm sharing the Kool-aid you are drinking! :D