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BobZag
10-16-2009, 02:26 PM
Uh-oh, we're doomed. :D

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Butler: Gonzaga is no longer the non-power six program of note. Gonzaga has its regular place alongside teams in the power six. Butler isn't there yet, but the Bulldogs are close. They're the NEXT program that should have staying power. Brad Stevens has figured out what some at Butler have not: stay put. Barry Collier thought it made sense to go for the money at Nebraska. He came back as the athletic director. Todd Lickliter may find it was better to have stayed than to have gone to Iowa, easily one of the tougher jobs in the Big Ten. You can't blame Thad Matta for leaving based on his track record of late and Ohio State's presence on the national scene. But Stevens has taken a collection of players who fit the Butler style to make this program one of the top 25 in the country. Butler was in the top 40 in the ESPN College Basketball Encyclopedia for the 2000s. Expect the 2010-to-2019 decade to produce the same result. Butler is being invited to quality events, both tournaments and made-for-TV neutral games. But more than that, they are earning Horizon League bids on a regular basis and winning in the NCAAs.

hockeyzag
10-16-2009, 02:38 PM
That would be Mr. Andy Katz: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=4565611&name=katz_andy

I love how he always has our back.

BroncoZAG615
10-16-2009, 02:46 PM
All sorts of Butler love at Gonzaga's expense:


Butler: Is Butler the new Gonzaga?

It's not uncommon for mid-major teams to creep to the top of the rankings, but most of the time they are unable to sustain that kind of success over time. Gonzaga has been the lone exception over the last 15 years, but now Butler is getting ready to match, and possibly surpass, what Gonzaga has done.

Last year at this time, Butler was beginning practice after losing four starters from a team that had won 30 games and took Tennessee to the wire in the second round of the NCAA tournament. Yet, the Bulldogs still went 26-6 and earned their eighth NCAA bid in 13 years. Now, the Bulldogs return four starters, only one of whom is a senior.

How good is Butler? Matt Howard, a 6-8 junior forward, was last year's Horizon League Player of the Year, and he might only be the second-best player on this team. That's because 6-8 sophomore Gordon Hayward returns after excelling for Team USA at the 19-and-under championships last summer. Hayward is a prodigious scorer who last season sank seven threes in a game on two occasions (including against Ohio State). The other players who started last season as freshmen, Shelvin Mack and Ronald Nored, will also benefit from having a year under their belts.

A tough preseason schedule that includes the 76 Classic should help determine if they're that good


Written by Seth (expletive) Davis from SI.com.

While I don't really care for the Butler program much (I don't know why, just don't), it is nice having another mid-major get most of the preseason hype.

BobZag
10-16-2009, 02:46 PM
But that doesn't sound like Katz. This reads like a compilation of various ESPN writers.

maynard g krebs
10-16-2009, 04:02 PM
IMO, the more good non-bcs programs the better. Gives more credibility all non-bcs teams in terms of recruiting. Thinking back to the days of Spencer Haywood at Detroit, Elvin Hayes at Houston, Walt Frazier at S. Ill., Bradley at Princeton, etc. etc., things were in some ways a lot more interesting when the Ivies, Tex. Western, etc. could really compete on the national level.

I look forward to the Zags, Butler, X all remaining topnotch, and others joining them. Rising tide lifts all boats, to borrow a tired cliche.

Would love to see a Zags-Butler home and home on nat. tv.

BobZag
10-16-2009, 04:13 PM
Btw, I like Butler and follow them along with X, WKU and other top non-BCS schools. And I agree with how coaches go searching for greener pastures, only to wish they had stayed at Butler. Monson wishes he'd have stayed, I'm sure. It's just the first sentence that's odd.

Do any of the analysts know just how good the Zags are lining up to be this year, next year, the year after, etc?

NotoriousZ
10-16-2009, 04:56 PM
Btw, I like Butler and follow them along with X, WKU and other top non-BCS schools. And I agree with how coaches go searching for greener pastures, only to wish they had stayed at Butler. Monson wishes he'd have stayed, I'm sure. It's just the first sentence that's odd.

Do any of the analysts know just how good the Zags are lining up to be this year, next year, the year after, etc?

I guess not, but this is a good thing. Personally, I'm looking forward to Lunardi's first bracket. But in a month or so we'll see what's what after we've played some games, and that's when we will be getting some good press!

CDC84
10-16-2009, 05:18 PM
Maybe it's just me, but I think Stevens is going to be staying at Butler for awhile.

I think Butler's success in recent times is every bit as impressive as Gonzaga's. In fact, it maybe more impressive. That program is located in an area that's surrounded by one BCS program after the next. Recruiting is very, very difficult, but they someone make it work. They are now starting to pick off players from Big 10 schools.

kylasdad
10-16-2009, 06:12 PM
Butler: Gonzaga is no longer the non-power six program of note. Gonzaga has its regular place alongside teams in the power six. Butler isn't there yet, but the Bulldogs are close. They're the NEXT program that should have staying power.

Bob,

I may be wrong but it seems like you might be reading this as a put down towards the zags.

To me the first line seems like that, but the second line is saying Gonzaga is above the non-power conferences, it "has its regular place alongside teams in the power six."

I apologize if I'm miss reading what you are saying, but I think this is intended to be a compliment to the Zags.

Go Zags!!!

WallaWallaZag
10-16-2009, 06:14 PM
i'm not sure anyone knows how good the zags are lining up to be...maybe even including the coaches...not yet anyways. i'm withholding judgement until some games are actually played. as far as i'm concerned, bouldin is the only proven commodity and everyone else is just untapped potential at this point. even meech and gray have only shown us flashes of what could be...

ZagDaddy
10-16-2009, 07:15 PM
Btw, I like Butler and follow them along with X, WKU and other top non-BCS schools. And I agree with how coaches go searching for greener pastures, only to wish they had stayed at Butler. Monson wishes he'd have stayed, I'm sure. It's just the first sentence that's odd.

Bob, you have an eye for a good program. Someone close to me has had considerable contact with Brad and his staff. He always walks away impressed saying the same thing when describing his program: He does things the right way.

My guess is he won't be going anywhere anytime soon.

Bogozags
10-17-2009, 07:09 AM
First off, I believe that Butler will be a top five program before it is said and done. Knowing that is putting myself out there but teams need three extremely solid players to be a force in todays college game. They have the point guard, who limited Curry in last year's Bracket Buster game. They have great play from the wing and their post play is tremendous. They have a great club, with an excellent coaching staff.

Secondly, I made a comment earlier that the Zags are going to truly provide a pleasant surprise this season. I will go as far to say that we will once again dominate WCC play, because or our seasoned freshman and redshirts. If Sacre has developed his foot work on the offensive end, they he will be a force with which to be dealt as we have all the outside weapons and depth at the post with him and Poling. This is going to be a great season, one in which we will remember for a long time to come and a "great start" for next season's run. Health and patience will be the key this year as there is only one ball, with which to play. I believe we win 24 games and return to the SS and with a little luck the EE.

The BCS schools get all the pre-season hype and that is fine by me, as it puts less expectations on schools like Butler and Gonzaga.

DADoZAG
10-17-2009, 07:17 AM
Do any of the analysts know just how good the Zags are lining up to be this year, next year, the year after, etc?

The question, when discussing a “program”, is always next year, the year after, etc.

Butler will have a great year this year, but may find themselves loosing a couple more players then one senior. The “H” brothers, Hayward and Howard, may be enticed by the big money, especially if Butler goes into April as some think they might.

Will Butler be able to bring in replacements for what may be 70% of their offense?

Where’s Butler Guy? Whose coming in for 2010, 2011? BZ, do you know? Has Brad Stevens begun looking? Will he “pull a Few” and bring in a GJ when he really doesn’t have the open scholie?

As for any type of slight to the ZAGS, when will we become fans that aren’t worried about what others are saying? The DVD is out, watch it. The program is what the program is, and no preseason poll, no op ed, no single loss or even a single loosing season will change that. It’s not about arrogance, it’s about true pride in what Gonzaga, the organization as a whole, has built. Be proud, be secure, and be true ZAGS.

Nevertheless, it’s the year of the Bulldog (Butler will represent well with the ZAGS barking at their heels), and next year will be too (it’ll be our turn). …and the next, and the next…

Go ZAGS!

By the way, the “H” brothers, are not related, at least I don’t think so, and there is no intention by DADoZAG to represent such, call it artistic license. One more thing, some may call us dreamers, but what turns a dreamer into a visionary, is following the path that makes your dreams come true. Do you see the path, or the obstacles beside it?

MDABE80
10-17-2009, 09:15 AM
Stevens is a local product.....HS, College and now Coaching. His first job was with Lilly Pharm in Indianapolis..then Butler since 2001. The school has a small school feel and a family type environment. He'll be there as long as he wants.

The article is poorly written and it's a bit hard to know exactly what theymean in the early going. When I read it, I thought ( like BZ) that is was a moderate slam. Upon review though, I think they're saying that GU is close to being in a league by itself and has a secure place with the 6 top conferences without being in one. GU is a welcome "stand alone" at the dinner table. Then they go one to say the Butler isn't far behind and will join GU soon as a deserved visitor. Awkward phrasing but it's a compliment.....I hope:)

BobZag
10-17-2009, 09:28 AM
I'm afraid Butler Guy knows a whole lot more about Butler's recruiting, etc. I have a hard enough time just trying to track our recruiting, lol.

cjm720
10-17-2009, 11:44 AM
Would love to see a zag v butler series. They Should be top ten most of the year....

Go zags!!

Butler Guy
10-17-2009, 02:47 PM
Well, Butler is done for '10 with forward Erik Fromm who is sort've one of those glue guy players that all good teams have. He plays for Bloomington South which might be the best team in the country. Khyle Marshall who is a top 100 small forward from near Miami, I think Marshall will start next year. The last is Chrishawn Hopkins who is one of the better guards in the midwest, you can read more on these guys by clicking the link at the bottom right of this post. Hopkins was recently rated 14th (http://hoopsmongrel.blogspot.com/2009/10/2010-mongreltopia-top-50.html) in the 5 state area of IL, IN, KY, OH, and MI by one local guy. Hopkins is sort of a YouTube sensation for his winning dunk contest at aau nationals.

In terms of 11 and 12, they happen to be two of the better classes in the region in a long time. Butler is a good position with many, probably most notably Cody Zeller who has been said BU has a slight lead for. (http://www.indystar.com/article/20091009/SPORTS0615/910090350/1287/SPORTS/Zeller+name+enough+to+bring+coaches)Zeller potentially could be an All-American like his brother.

I too believe that Brad Stevens doesn't have a desire to leave, it is a pretty good situation for him.

If you have anymore questions feel free to ask, but the site might be better.