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BobZag
08-14-2009, 02:22 PM
Least Likely scenario for 2009-10:


1. Gonzaga's freshmen step in to compliment the veterans for a smooth transition that doesn't skip a beat and, in fact, improves on last year's team due to Bouldin, Gray, Meech and Sacre stepping their games up and the newcomers' athleticism and talent and skill level surpasses expectations and catches opponents by surprise. The result: 3 losses total and a WCC sweep.

1a. Gonzaga's freshmen totally bomb and underachieve while the veteran Zags slump. Injuries pile up and opposing teams smell blood and the team suffers one lopsided loss after another. The result: .500 season.


Likelier scenario:

After four starters depart, the four remaining Zags who have played significant minutes step up, improving their games and carry the team to a respectable November and December, after which the newcomers start to gel and the team starts to roll towards March. The result: 7 losses.


Likeliest scenario:

Youth causes and up and down season where the newcomers look like world beaters one game and like the Keystone Kops the next game. The returning players are mostly steady and save the day a few times but can't always make up for the erratic performances of the newbies. In this up/down scenario, the Zags could win Maui and beat Duke and lose to Pepperdine and WSU. The result: 9 losses.


Agree? Disagree? Your thoughts.

OZZag
08-14-2009, 02:44 PM
BZ I am leaning toward scenario 2 with 7 losses. Even though there is a tremendous amount of talent coming in, it will take time for the newcomers to learn the system, and learn to play with their new teammates. With the experience of the guards, if big Rob and Andy start controllling the middle they could improve the number of wins by a couple.

JohnOGU
08-14-2009, 02:45 PM
I have a lot of confidence in the new guys. Especially Poling, Gibbs, Harris, and Kong. Don't get me wrong, I have all the confidence in the ability of the other guys, just not sure about decision making. We definitely will not have a .500 season. I think it'll be a relatively smooth transition. All going to depend on our rebounding, which seems like it won't be a problem.

I'm going to go with least likely scenario 1a, or the likelier scenario.

GO ZAGS

zag67
08-14-2009, 03:19 PM
JohnO, I am going to mostly agree with you, but I think that the players that will step up in the beginning will be Harris, Poling and Arop. Then as the season goes on Gibbs will be a solid player for 5 to 8 minutes and Kong will get better and better as the season goes on. IMO, Kong will take some time due to his lack of playing competitively for over a year. The point will be solid, with Meech and GJ doing most of the minutes, but Matt will be there against some teams.
So I am going 3 to 7 losses, sweep the WCC and win at least 2 games in March.

GoZags
08-14-2009, 03:22 PM
Zags will go .500 in the NCAA tourney. My guess is an 8 loss Zag squad will win the 8/9 game and lose a heartbreaker to a 1 seed in the 2nd round. However, the experience gained will prove invaluable for '10/'11 -- which will result in the Zags' deepest March run ever.

GoZAGsMang
08-14-2009, 03:35 PM
GoZags nailed it

and by the end of the season everyone will know about the "Mang"
(Mang Arop will make a "meech play" in the dance)

GoZAGsMang

MickMick
08-14-2009, 04:00 PM
Nine losses? I'll wager not.

I think the team does better. I think the turnover rate will be comparable to last season. They won't win Maui or beat Duke, but last year's team probably wouldn't have fared much better.

Nine is a bit much for this talented squad.

ronh_pm
08-14-2009, 04:09 PM
I think the season will be mostly determined by how Coach Few plays the freshman.

If all the freshmen see significant minutes I think it will be a sign that this season is an investment for next year and the "Likeliest scenario" will probably be the result. The raw talent of the young guns will will some games but the lack of experience and polish at this level of ball will show in the tight ones.

If the minutes are doled out in favour of the vets and say only Manny and Bol getting the bulk of the bench minutes with sprinkles for the rest then I think the Zags have a good run through the WCC and the "Likelier scenario" comes into play.

Either way I tend to agree that even though this year may see it share of success, the real payoff will start next year.

cheers.

Reborn
08-14-2009, 04:46 PM
This will be a tough season, somewhat similar to the '07 Zags after they lost Heytvelt at mid-season. It looked like the Zags were doomed then, and would not win the WCC, and not make it to the BIG DANCE in March for the first time in 8 years. But Ravio, in his last year as a Zag, somehow mobilized his buddies and they had an awesome end to the season. They did not win a game in the big dance, but lost to a very good Indiana team in the first round. They just did not have a center who could handle Indiana's big man. This year the Zags will be similar, as losing 4 Senors, and then Austin, will be a huge blow initially, but Bouldin will pull this team together with a lot of help from Steven Gray, Meech and Manny Arop. I think this years team has a better and bigger center and by the end of the season Sacre will be much better. The Freshmen and red shirts really come on strong, much stronger than some thought possible.

This years team is fresh. The dark cloud which hung over the '09 team is gone. The chemistry is awesome, and the Zag spirit is unbreakable. To most people's surprise the Zags play great together and play unselfishly throughout the season. Harris and Arop conribute "big time" from the very beginning, and show that their international play this summer did help them a lot. I think Gibb's play will also be a big eye opener, and his shooting and toughness will remind us of Stepp as a Freshman. Arop will demonstrate the confidence that Adam Morrison had as a Freshman, but will do even more because the team really needs his scoring. Harris will NOT remind us of JP because he's such a good ball handler, but he does have a wide body. He is a bigger Pendograft, with good shooting and ball handling skills. Olynyk does not red-shirt, and has some very good moments off the bench. One of the big surprises is Will Foster. He finally comes into his own, and his back up play really helps out the Zags. Poling, as well, has very good moments.

Bol Kong does not come to Gonzaga. But it doenn't matter because the other guys really step up, especially Arop. In some ways Kong's "no show" makes it easier on Mark Few. To everyone's surprise, the Zags repeat and make it to the Sweet 16 again. There is going to be a great game in the NCAA tournament and a huge upset. Matt makes 2nd team All-American, and Manny Arop makes Honorable Mention.

BroncoZAG615
08-14-2009, 04:57 PM
This years team is fresh. The dark cloud which hung over the '09 team is gone.

What dark cloud hung over the '09 team?


Bol Kong does not come to Gonzaga.

What makes you believe Bol will not be at Gonzaga when some of the most trusted posters and some close to the situation claim the opposite?

MDABE80
08-14-2009, 05:21 PM
1. THE DARK CLOUD??????????

2."Bol Kong does not come to Gonzaga. But it doenn't matter because the other guys really step up, especially Arop." WHAT IS THIS!!!

Guys will be fine. 8 losses is about right. Duke will be close but we won't beat em. Maui? lol....nope maybe a 3rd place.

Lots of factors are loose in this year's team. Not sure Rob is a big time center...just because he has size. He really wasn't a jewel the first year. Hope he's better but it's wait and see with me.
I have very little worry about the guards if...a big if too...Few gets some balance down low. Guards are key but no guard cleans up if there's not big men to snag boards, block out and hit those guys on outlet.

I think it'll be another 20 win season but the team won't gel untill the send half of the year. PDX looks very sound in the WCC. We might not win it this yer but it'll be close. I don't think we'll run the table....unless the WCC is weaker than I think.

seasontixholder
08-14-2009, 05:52 PM
GU should be OK against the teams that it outathletes. The question is whether it can field a lineup that is competitive against the elite teams. Last year's squad had the bodies to do so. From the looks of the roster, it will take better defense, rebounding, and much better passing effectiveness to overcome the loss of pro-type bodies and the shot-blocking advantage that produced low defensive FG %age of '09. Improvement in free throw %age would be welcome, and is quite possible.

zag67
08-14-2009, 07:12 PM
So Seasontix, lets take your things that we need to improve 1 by 1.
For this "guess", I am assuming the Olynyk will redshirt. And folks remember all of this is fanacy, but it is my best shot with some facts and guesses. I also believe that this is the best set of athletes Gonzaga has ever had, which will allow them to make more mistakes and still recover.

First Rebounding:
Last year we had a 4 playing our 5 and a 3 playing a 4 and neither one of them preferred to be under the basket. This year that we have Sacre, Poling, Harris and Dower all seem to like doing dirty work. Also Matt, Arop and Kong seem to have the bodies and ability to attack the boards.

Defense:
I think that we first will be better on the point. We lost Jeremy, but we will have more speed with Meech and GJ. At the 2/3 we will have Matt and Steven will have another year of experience. We lost Micah, but we will be gaining Arop and Kong. We lost Daye and we gain Harris and Poling. And lastly we lost Josh, and we will have Foster, Dower and Sacre in the middle. Also I think that we have quicker athletes that should cause more turnovers by the opponents. I also think that with the number of potentially super players, they will be playing less time and therefore will be more rested to play hard defense.

Passing effeciency:

I think that Meech, GJ and Matt all have the mindset to find the open person first and shoot second. This should lead to more open shots on the break. Also Arop and Harris have been playing international play. I do believe that the coaching staff will need to initially simplify the sets when many of the new players on in.

Let the season begin so that we can watch and not guess what is going to happen.

MickMick
08-14-2009, 07:30 PM
So Seasontix, lets take your things that we need to improve 1 by 1.
For this "guess", I am assuming the Olynyk will redshirt. And folks remember all of this is fanacy, but it is my best shot with some facts and guesses. I also believe that this is the best set of athletes Gonzaga has ever had, which will allow them to make more mistakes and still recover.

First Rebounding:
Last year we had a 4 playing our 5 and a 3 playing a 4 and neither one of them preferred to be under the basket. This year that we have Sacre, Poling, Harris and Dower all seem to like doing dirty work. Also Matt, Arop and Kong seem to have the bodies and ability to attack the boards.

Defense:
I think that we first will be better on the point. We lost Jeremy, but we will have more speed with Meech and GJ. At the 2/3 we will have Matt and Steven will have another year of experience. We lost Micah, but we will be gaining Arop and Kong. We lost Daye and we gain Harris and Poling. And lastly we lost Josh, and we will have Foster, Dower and Sacre in the middle. Also I think that we have quicker athletes that should cause more turnovers by the opponents. I also think that with the number of potentially super players, they will be playing less time and therefore will be more rested to play hard defense.

Passing effeciency:

I think that Meech, GJ and Matt all have the mindset to find the open person first and shoot second. This should lead to more open shots on the break. Also Arop and Harris have been playing international play. I do believe that the coaching staff will need to initially simplify the sets when many of the new players on in.

Let the season begin so that we can watch and not guess what is going to happen.

Outstanding post. You put it all together better than I could. For the reasons you have put before us (as well as others), I think that this young team could be potentially better than last year's squad. Role players playing within thier respective roles....imagine that.

Reborn
08-14-2009, 07:48 PM
What makes you believe Bol will not be at Gonzaga when some of the most trusted posters and some close to the situation claim the opposite?

The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

vandalzag
08-14-2009, 08:08 PM
Most Likely:
Some poster(s) will lament how current player _____________ does not play like former player___________________.

GoZags
08-14-2009, 08:26 PM
The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

Just drew a little blood biting my tongue.

And it doesn't help that the man says "I must spread some rep around before giving it to Reborn again".

JohnOGU
08-14-2009, 08:52 PM
I really think Kong will have a significant impact from the get-go. That kid is just has the skill and IQ to be a star. Not taking anything away from anyone else--Manny is VERY impressive. So glad we have both of them. Same build, Manny is just a little shorter.

ZagsGoZags
08-14-2009, 08:54 PM
I tend to largely agree with Zag67
By Feb the freshmen will be pouring it on, lose 5-8 games, get by first game in NCAA dance, and perhaps Sweet 16 again.
At least one person is going to leap out at the world the way Turiaf, Dan, Ammo, JP (batista) have done. There is just too much athleticism, to not see truly elite talent develop in one of these guys, and it could even be Gray

Nevtelen
08-14-2009, 09:10 PM
Outstanding post. You put it all together better than I could. For the reasons you have put before us (as well as others), I think that this young team could be potentially better than last year's squad. Role players playing within thier respective roles....imagine that.

Besides increased TOs, I think the D will suffer, at least in the beginning of the season, for sure. So much of D is communicating and knowing what your teammates are doing and all being on the same page. With so many new faces, it'll take a while for all of them to be on the same page. Also, unless Sacre has really improved his D (which he might have, granted), he wasn't all that great on D in the post. Also, the team loses Micah, probably the best all-around defender on the floor, and Austin's amazing shot-blocking and inbounding defense.

There is definitely something to be said for having players actually play in their 'natural' posititons, but it's also quite possible that the majority of any game there will still be players out of position, with Bouldin or Gray playing (and defending) the wing for long stretches.

I really do think this will be a 9 loss team that only barely breaks the 20 win mark. There will be lots of flashes of greatness, but there will be some head-scratchers, too.

BroncoZAG615
08-14-2009, 09:37 PM
The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

It's a Jesuit school, my man. Have a little faith.

ronh_pm
08-14-2009, 10:00 PM
Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

I don't want to derail this thread more than it already is however I guess I can understand you doubting a blogger who is far removed from Gonzaga, this forum and the established posters here.

On the other hand, it was reported in Vancouver's second largest newspaper, the Vancouver Sun, that Bol would be going to Gonzaga this fall. Someone told the reporter that Bol was going to Gonzaga. As she had just interviewed Bol, I would have to guess that Boltold the reporter, not a blogger.

Now there remains the possibilty I suppose, that as Bol thinks he will be playing basketball for Gonzaga this season, but in fact will not be. I guess when he heads down on the 24th and finds that there is no locker, no roster position, no practice jersey and no class list, he, like the rest of us, will find out that he is not.

(is there already an "is he isn't he thread" dedicated to Bol...maybe we need to sticky one for a couple of weeks so these great threads don't lose focus?)

Cheers.

hockeyzag
08-14-2009, 10:03 PM
The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

Great post Reborn, I agree completely.

Angelo Roncalli
08-14-2009, 10:06 PM
The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

Bob, GoZags, and I have posted numerous times that we believe Bol Kong will be coming before school starts. My source is pretty good. His name is Robert J. Spitzer, S.J. I realize he's not president of the school anymore, but I still believe he has some reliable first-hand knowledge. Fr. Spitzer told me three times about Bol...at a dinner in Seattle, at the WCC tournament and at his farewell function at Eastside Catholic High School in June. He said it to the whole crowd of nearly 300 people at EC. Others who post on this board were there. I know that Fr. Spitzer told GoZags the same thing. Bob has heard it from other sources. Hearsay all, I concede. But it's hearsay that I'm comfortable with.

We've also posted, numerous times, that there likely would not be any official announcement until he arrives on campus. This was EXACTLY the same situation as occurred when Ronny Turiaf came to GU.

Then there's the article from earlier this week in the Vancouver Sun. It's the largest circulation newspaper in Western Canada. The story stated:


Kong, who is off to Gonzaga this fall on a full scholarship, says it's harder to score here than it is indoors because of the double ring on the top of the basket in the outdoor courts -- not to mention the wind. He feels the double challenge has made him better, too.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Canada+hoops+mecca/1880656/story.html

Do you think the reporter just made that up? Possible, I guess, but not likely.

So, you would choose to believe a speculative post from "someone who seems to know" rather than these multiple sources? I guess it's your right. Of course something might arise in the next two weeks that prevents his arrival, there's always the possibility for something unforeseen or anticipated. He could be in a car wreck at the Peace Arch, God forbid.

But, if you truly doubt, then let's make a little wager. I've got 5 C notes that says he'll be on campus in September. I'll send the money to Bob to hold if you will do the same.

BTW, do you think President Obama was born in Kenya?

CaliforniaZaggin'
08-14-2009, 10:24 PM
I certainly understand the skepticism about whether Bol will actually be playing for the Zags next season. We first heard about Bol's (alleged) commitment to GU about 18 months, but, to the best of my knowledge, he hasn't set foot on campus during that time. Personally, I feel confident about Bol becoming a Zag, but I can absolutely understand those, like reborn, who have the I'll-believe-it-when-I-see-it attitude.

GoZags
08-14-2009, 10:28 PM
I certainly understand the skepticism about whether Bol will actually be playing for the Zags next season. We first heard about Bol's (alleged) commitment to GU about 18 months, but, to the best of my knowledge, he hasn't set foot on campus during that time. Personally, I feel confident about Bol becoming a Zag, but I can absolutely understand those, like reborn, who have the I'll-believe-it-when-I-see-it attitude.

Except he didn't say that. He said the dark cloud that hung over last year's team is gone, and he said Kong is not coming. None of this "I'll believe it when I see it" business.

I'm not sure how many schools would love to have a "dark cloud" Sweet 16 appearance. Probably 325 (of the 341 schools that play D1 hoops

Rangerzag
08-14-2009, 11:35 PM
I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

Reborn, if you have been absent, you should keep that in mind.

The last page listed in the backed up posts is from 2007. The answers to your questions lay between here on page one and page 558 from back in 2007.



PS. Sorry, belatedly, for your loss!

Reborn
08-15-2009, 12:41 AM
Except he didn't say that. He said the dark cloud that hung over last year's team is gone, and he said Kong is not coming. None of this "I'll believe it when I see it" business.

I'm not sure how many schools would love to have a "dark cloud" Sweet 16 appearance. Probably 325 (of the 341 schools that play D1 hoops

By the "dark cloud" I was merely thinking about all of the adversity that the '09 team had to overcome, and in particular Josh, Micah and Pargo. I agree that the '09 team overcame the adversity, and in the end the sunshine broke through the dark clouds. To deny that there were a lot of people who had a lot of doubt about last years team is at least as much of an error in judement as someone who says that there were. And I am glad to say I was NOT one of them.

I thought for a minute, "What would it be like if Kong did NOT come? Could the Zags be successful without him?" So I imagined what it would be like, and then wrote what I thought. I am kind of surprised that my thoughts got such a strong reaction from a few bloggers. Honestly, I am not convinced that Kong will be in a Zag uniform next year. Do I hope he will be? Hell yes. The guy is awesome.

Reborn
08-15-2009, 01:10 AM
Reborn, if you have been absent, you should keep that in mind.

The last page listed in the backed up posts is from 2007. The answers to your questions lay between here on page one and page 558 from back in 2007.

PS. Sorry, belatedly, for your loss!

Sometimes, Rangerzag, you just got to go with your gut feelings. Those were my feellings at the time. BZ asked what we thought, and I just replied. My observations may be wrong. But they may be right. In this case, I truly hope I'm wrong because I really want to see him playing for the Zags. So much has been written about him, and I am really excited to see him play. And my doubts have kind of bummed me out a little. I had no idea that Fr. Spitzer had told Angelo or Gozags that Kong was coming for sure. BZ is right about most things that he posts about, but not always. And I thought, that maybe he called this one wrong.

MickMick
08-15-2009, 04:13 AM
Between August 24 and August 27.

NotoriousZ
08-15-2009, 05:32 AM
By the "dark cloud" I was merely thinking about all of the adversity that the '09 team had to overcome, and in particular Josh, Micah and Pargo. I agree that the '09 team overcame the adversity, and in the end the sunshine broke through the dark clouds. To deny that there were a lot of people who had a lot of doubt about last years team is at least as much of an error in judement as someone who says that there were. And I am glad to say I was NOT one of them.

I thought for a minute, "What would it be like if Kong did NOT come? Could the Zags be successful without him?" So I imagined what it would be like, and then wrote what I thought. I am kind of surprised that my thoughts got such a strong reaction from a few bloggers. Honestly, I am not convinced that Kong will be in a Zag uniform next year. Do I hope he will be? Hell yes. The guy is awesome.

I thought that's what you meant when I first read it, but if you had explained it that way to begin with we wouldn't have had all the hubbub about it. Kong is the #1 hot topic issue and you just can't say he's not coming and not expect a response. I agree with you most of the time, because I'm also an optimist, so keep up the good work.

For my $.02, I don't think a 5 loss season is out of the question. Few can find a way for the newbies to fit in, and we have experience where we need it--at the guard positions. I'd also be fine with a 7-9 loss season, as long as we put it all together by March!

Rangerzag
08-15-2009, 06:15 AM
Sometimes, Rangerzag, you just got to go with your gut feelings. .................
...................BZ is right about most things that he posts about, but not always. And I thought, that maybe he called this one wrong.

Reborn, I certainly recognize your normal overflowing optimism. Some, rare, times you are susceptible to mood swings.

You are welcome to consider that I have been reassured (http://www.guboards.spokesmanreview.com/showpost.php?p=448428&postcount=7)by a very good source (read BobZag), that the Summer prospectus roster only lists twelve scholarship players. Isn't thirteen the number of authorized scholarships at a time?? That certainly leaves room for Kong once he arrives.

bigblahla
08-15-2009, 07:18 AM
The fact that he still isn't here. The fact that there has not yet been an official announcement. The fact that he is not listed on the summer WCC Team Roster and Harris is. The fact that someone who seems to know him that posted said "if he comes down there." What was with that if? I have not seen any of what you call the "most trusted posters" tell us he is coming. I have not seen that posted yet. Not by BZ, not by CDC, and not by ZagNative. Nor have I seen anyone say he is accept the blogger who took the pics of him and said he talked to Bol.

If he is coming why hasn't there been an announcement? It's Aug 14th.

Reborn,
I'd say you are a glutton for punishment and wonder what you'll be doing for social activities when the Flat Earth Society disbands upon Bol's arrival as mentioned in another thread. ;)

Just so you know what I think!!!!!!










Boom! Boom! Boom! :D


Go!! Zags!!!

vandalzag
08-15-2009, 07:32 AM
Just like we tell my children at Christmas you must believe to receive. Soon he will be here.

FuManShoes
08-15-2009, 09:37 AM
I think some of you are being a bit hard on Reborn. This Kong thing has gotten out of hand. Of course we want Canada's best hoopster to show up on campus and don a Zags uni. But hoping and believing it and citing assured comments from insiders -- even from Kong himself -- won't make it so, only the man-god's actual appearance will do that. And it makes it hard to predict how the team will do without some concrete proof that Kong -- a definite impact player -- will be in the mix. So Reborn ponders what the team will do if Kong isn't on it. Makes sense to me.

As for next year's team I worry about a logjam at the 2/3, especially if Kong arrives, and Robert's ability to stay healthy. A lot is riding on his big shoulders.

BobZag
08-15-2009, 09:57 AM
and Robert's ability to stay healthy. A lot is riding on his big shoulders.

Amen.

HillBillyZag
08-15-2009, 01:01 PM
Because he will have be Superman, to live up to the hype that many of you are dumping on his back. If I were a returning player and read this board I would be looking to transfer ASAP, for the Sophomores and Freshmen will get all the playing time. Fortunately Coach Few does'nt load the kids down with hype, he plays the kids who get the job done.

CDC84
08-15-2009, 05:15 PM
For the record, I have said all along that I felt Kong would be at Gonzaga this season. I just don't comment about Bol on this board on a regular basis because there is really nothing to talk about. It's that simple. I don't personally know the government officials, bureaucrats and other people who were involved in trying to get Bol into the U.S. There was a ton of red tape involved in his situation, and one of the consequences of red tape is slow progress. I knew patience was going to be required.

In recent times people have questioned whether this or that player name would be at Gonzaga....whether it was Theo Davis, Ronny Turiaf, Jeremy Pargo, etc. Despite all of the skepticism and questioning the player always seems to get admitted, made eligible and physically appear on the Gonzaga campus. Obviously, there are some exceptions like Ian Mahinmi. Yes, there have been some "mystery" foreign players who have failed to materialize, but no known names.

kitzbuel
08-15-2009, 06:19 PM
Yes, there have been some "mystery" foreign players who have failed to materialize, but no known names.

Greivis Vasquez?

BobZag
08-16-2009, 09:08 AM
Ian Mahinmi for one.

Meanwhile, the Kongmobile is ready...

http://www.nerve.com/CS/blogs/modernmaterialist/2008/08/batmobile_side_view.jpg

GU69
08-16-2009, 09:59 AM
Assuming that Mr. Kong does become a Zag, I hope that he is half as much fun in real life as he is as a myth.

bigblahla
08-16-2009, 11:27 AM
Assuming that Mr. Kong does become a Zag, I hope that he is half as much fun in real life as he is as a myth.

Wouldn't that be as a Mythtr not a Myth? :D

Go!! Zags!!!

CDC84
08-16-2009, 11:46 AM
Greivis Vasquez?

Vasquez never committed to Gonzaga at any point despite Coach Lloyd discovering him and placing him at Montrose Christian back east. Moreover, he became plan B when Matt Bouldin appeared on the scene. I'm talking about players who are actually supposed to come to GU - especially guys like Bol Kong, Jeremy Pargo, etc. who had to jump thru some hurdles to play for the Zags. Despite all of the uncertainities, it ended up working out in the end.

Ian Mahinmi was all set to come to GU but in the end decided to bolt for the NBA. I didn't see that coming at all. I was more concerned with him going pro in Europe. But even then, the issue of him planning to come to GU but then not coming wasn't due to any hurdles that were placed in front of him. It was the result of an opportunity. It was because the San Antonio Spurs wanted him as a 1st round NBA draft pick.

GoZags
08-16-2009, 12:18 PM
Johan Petro was a Zag commit (Ian actually signed with Gonzaga prior to declaring for the draft). Johan didn't sign (but Tommy and Ronny got him to commit).

Johan also entered the draft -- and was a 1st round pick of the Sonics.

229SintoZag
08-16-2009, 03:33 PM
nobody knows what is going to happen this year or what we are dealing with. We all can offer educated guesses, nothing more. So when April comes and the season is over, nobody should be surprised. Disappointed? Sure. Elated at a year of seamless rebuilding? Perhaps. But not surprised.

CDC84
08-16-2009, 06:01 PM
Getting back to the original topic:


Likelier scenario: After four starters depart, the four remaining Zags who have played significant minutes step up, improving their games and carry the team to a respectable November and December, after which the newcomers start to gel and the team starts to roll towards March. The result: 7 losses.

I like this, but I have a different twist.

For me the problem with this year's Zag team is the fact that they have so many players who have not played with one another. People have got to understand that most top 25 teams have had their entire roster on campus - both newcomers and returning players - since the early part of the summer, while the Zags have been spread out. Elias Harris, Bol Kong, Manny Arop and Kelly Olynyk all figure to be key contributors to varying degrees, and yet they arenít going to appear on campus until the very last minute. All 4 guys are foreign players who havenít played with the guys who are on campus, and they all have to learn one of the most complicated offenses in the college game in about 2 months. They are already 2 months behind. You add that on to the fact that there are two genuine freshmen in Vilarino and Dower, plus 2 redshirt freshmen in Poling and Gibbs, and there is going to be a big adjustment period, and itís all going to have to take place in the 2 months before the real games begin.

The fact of the matter is that it wonít all take place in 2 monthsÖ.people are going to be learning on the job. Baptism by fire against the likes of Michigan State and other high major teams.

The good news is that several of the newcomers like Harris and Arop are not your typical freshmen physically or mentally, and I think their play is not going to go through the kinds of ups and downs that we typically see from GU newcomers. Itís going to be a young team, but it wonít like your typical young team. My main concern has to do with the guys getting used to playing with another. How many non-league losses will occur before it starts coming together? Come WCC time I think the Zags are going to be in pretty good shape, but I just hope that their record is good enough to ensure a decent seed come tourney time. With the WCC being down this season, getting key non-league wins is going to be even more important than usual. The Zags arenít likely going to have a chance to pick up a couple of top 50 RPI wins within their league.

alaskazagnut
08-16-2009, 09:13 PM
3-4 losses.

No matter the players, barring injuries, Few and company will coach any healthy Zag team into the big dance.

I hate it when people say that Few was "outcoached" after a loss. Its not true in the sense that any coach is better than Few. It is a game, Few is never outcoached. He might get unlucky every now and then, or gamble on a tough end of game strategy and lose. But it's the whole team that just wasn't their best that given night. And that includes the coaching staff.

LongIslandZagFan
08-17-2009, 06:12 AM
With the schedule that borders on evil considering this team's youth, I will lean toward 8-9 losses and possibly getting into the dance with an at-large bid. Youth is going to take its toll. Part of me thinks that Matt may be destined for great things this year... nothing concrete... just a gut feeling.

cjm720
08-17-2009, 07:41 AM
I think the season will be mostly determined by how Coach Few plays the freshman.

If all the freshmen see significant minutes I think it will be a sign that this season is an investment for next year and the "Likeliest scenario" will probably be the result. The raw talent of the young guns will will some games but the lack of experience and polish at this level of ball will show in the tight ones.

If the minutes are doled out in favour of the vets and say only Manny and Bol getting the bulk of the bench minutes with sprinkles for the rest then I think the Zags have a good run through the WCC and the "Likelier scenario" comes into play.

Either way I tend to agree that even though this year may see it share of success, the real payoff will start next year.

cheers.


I think Ronh nailed it. I'd add Poling and Harris to the mix for a much needed inside presence. Few continues to fine-tune his coaching style and this year will be a large test. I cannot wait to see it all unfold.

GO ZAGS!!!

LongIslandZagFan
08-17-2009, 10:35 AM
With the schedule that borders on evil considering this team's youth, I will lean toward 8-9 losses and possibly getting into the dance with an at-large bid. Youth is going to take its toll. Part of me thinks that Matt may be destined for great things this year... nothing concrete... just a gut feeling.

Forgot to add... put me firmly in the Kong doubter camp... not that I ever left that camp.

75Zag
08-17-2009, 11:19 AM
The tea leaves I am smoking are indicating a difficult year for GU. Unexpected losses in WCC are ahead.

Oh wait! That's not tea!!!!

Sent from 5 miles due west of Astoria Oregon. Big Chinook and no wind or waves today.

Go Bulldogs! Get Bigger!

titopoet
08-17-2009, 11:25 AM
6 losses with some surprising wins and losses. Beating MSU, OU, Wake and Duke, while losing to some teams they should beat (not mentioning them as not to jix them)

SU did not have great 3 point shooting last year and that was with Suton. Suton going out to the three point line opened up the interior and the deciding factor in beating KU, UCONN and their run to the title game. MSU needs to find a consistent 3 threat or they will struggle against elite teams. Their first game without Suton and GU going in to make a statement will make the difference in that game.

Duke is hurting with only 3 guards (Unless they get Curry into the lineup, with Dawkins magically graduating and going to Duke year early, anything is possible. Maybe a hardship case as his brother, Seth needs to cheer for him during the NBA season for his mental health. Who knows?)

OU is tied to how consistent Warren is, and last year he just disappeared in big games.

Wake lost more than we did, and will be scrambling. I think they will be like Butler last year, when everyone thought they would decline only to have a great year. The will get a higher seeding than last years Butler team (having a better schedule). They will be a dangerous team in March as all of the newcomers will have gotten the experience they need. Sweet 16 or with a favorable pairing elite 8.

Baldwinzag
08-18-2009, 01:08 PM
I go into every season with little to no expectations.

That way, I don't become bitter & resentful if they're not met, and can enjoy the success more as it unfolds.

If history is any indication, we'll likely win more than 20 games. If we happen to win the WCC tourney, awesome! After that, its all gravy. :)

Angelo Roncalli
09-16-2009, 12:18 PM
But, if you truly doubt, then let's make a little wager. I've got 5 C notes that says he'll be on campus in September. I'll send the money to Bob to hold if you will do the same.


You sent your share of the wager to Bob to hold, right? :)

NotoriousZ
09-16-2009, 01:28 PM
Hey Reborn!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelo Roncalli
But, if you truly doubt, then let's make a little wager. I've got 5 C notes that says he'll be on campus in September. I'll send the money to Bob to hold if you will do the same.


You sent your share of the wager to Bob to hold, right? :)


Don't worry Angelo, I've got Moose and Rocco ready here to help Reborn find his checkbook.

BobZag
09-16-2009, 02:53 PM
I was supposed to hold that money?!

Oops. :o

Reborn
09-16-2009, 04:03 PM
Congrats to you, Angelo. Sorry to hear that BZ spent the money. I'm now so glad I never sent him the money. I tried to tell you that you CAN'T TRUST BZ..lol lol lol.

I believe my doubts were not unfounded. I am really glad he's here, and that the waiting for him to come is over. Now we can really concentrate on Zag basketball and basketball players' game. I'm glad you'lll be able to rest better now, BZ. And mostly, I'm glad I primarily stayed out of the Bol Kong drama, even if I was the first to shed doubts that he'd be here. My doubts were merely based on what I had been reading up to that point. BZ had doubts for sure...or let's just say he voiced doubt as much as he voiced blind faith. I never criticized BZ, and in fact supported him. Bob was merely reporting what he hears from pretty good sources. Those sources' integrity is still in tact, and for that I am very glad.

By the way. I never took Angelo's bet because I never expressed that strong of doubt. I didn't bellieve he WOULDN'T COME. I just doubted that he would. I think doubt during this episode is a pretty sane feeling. The doubt was real and strong. I hoped with the rest of us, as I am sure all Zag fans did, THAT Kong would be in a Zag uniform this year.

All in all the Bol Kong story provided a lot of fans a lot of fun for the summer. For that I'm glad. It has been the craziest, and funniest story since I've been a member of this board. May we all now know the peace that should follow his arrival. I know I already feel better, because the bottom line is that Bol Kong will make Gonzaga a better team.

Ekrub
01-26-2010, 02:18 PM
Looks like you got option 1 right.

DixieZag
01-26-2010, 02:29 PM
Oh no, it is waaaaaaay to early to rule out anything but the 7-9 group. We still have 2 "likely" games with SMC, 1 game with Portland, an away game with Memphis and a road trip to Pepp/LMU both of which showed at least they deserved to be in the WCC. I still LOVE the 3 loss prediction, now consider it more likely than 9 losses, but we cannot declare victory yet. Right now, if offered, I would take a 4 loss season going into the tourney so long as that one more loss is not in the conference tourney, that would hurt we love winning the league.

Colbyspapa
01-26-2010, 02:37 PM
We are on our way to 28-3 heading to the NCAAs and I'm thinking the Elite 8 this year. Because that is when we run into Duke again.... Crap!

LynetteG
01-26-2010, 06:38 PM
we can beat them, Matt isn't post-concussive now.

zagfan08
01-26-2010, 06:43 PM
First off, Matt at 100% may have kept us within 25. And secondly, I'm not sure we would be able to overcome the mental obstacle of facing a team that beat us by 35 earlier in the year.

So IF we can get a 3 seed, I'm praying for somebody other than Duke as the 2 in our region.

zagfan16
01-26-2010, 07:02 PM
First off, Matt at 100% may have kept us within 25. And secondly, I'm not sure we would be able to overcome the mental obstacle of facing a team that beat us by 35 earlier in the year.

So IF we can get a 3 seed, I'm praying for somebody other than Duke as the 2 in our region.

I disagree of any teams that could get a two I believe Duke to be the most beatable. Mainly because of their lack of depth, Duke will be more beatable by tourney time. I also doubt that being beat by 35 on a night you don't play well has anymore impact than playing your heart out and losing by a bucket.

bartruff1
01-26-2010, 07:49 PM
I think it might even be a advantage...