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freezer12
03-04-2009, 02:18 PM
I did this analysis to squash the thought that Josh Heytvelt deserved POY honors over John Bryant, specifically because he "owned" him head-to-head. I don't expect many (or any) Zags to agree with me, but when you look at the conference stats, it's pretty clear that Big John had a better year overall and that their head-to-head matchup was essentially a wash.

FIRST MEETING (SCU@GU, 1/15/09, GU 95 SCU 53):
-Heytvelt: 25 min, 4-9 fg, 0-1 3fg, 3-4 ft, 11 pts, 6 reb (1 off)
-Bryant: 27 min, 5-12 fg, 2-3 ft, 12 pts, 11 reb (4 off)

CONCLUSION GAME 1:
-I would say that the first match-up was basically a wash, with possibly a slight edge going to Big John. Neither were in foul trouble, yet Bryant had absolutely no help on offense. Only other person in double figures was Rahon with 14. Four other Zags had double figures with Daye leading the way with 20. Dowdell and Traz simply could not guard the kid.

SECOND MEETING (GU@SCU, 2/26/09, GU 81 SCU 73):
-Heytvelt: 35 min, 12-17 fg, 2-2 3fg, 3-5 ft, 29 pts, 9 reb (3 off), 2 blocks
-Bryant: 25 min, 7-9 fg, 2-2 ft, 16 pts, 11 reb (3 off), 2 blocks

CONCLUSIONS GAME 2:
-If you simply look at the stats for the game, Heytvelt outplayed Bryant with 29 pts to 16 pts. However, Heytvelt played 10 more minutes than Bryant did due to early foul trouble, which leads me to...
-Let's take a look at what Heytvelt did while Big John was on the bench with fouls. Bryant picks up foul #1 with 7:01 left in the 1st half. Not a big deal. However, with 6:29 left, Bryant picks up foul #2. In comes Dowdell, out goes Big John. For the rest of the half, Heytvelt goes for 6 pts, 1 reb, 2 stls.
-Big John starts the 2nd half with 2 fouls and picks up foul #3 with 15:46 left. In comes Dowdell, out goes Bryant till the 11:58 mark. During this time, Heytvelt goes for 1 pt, 2 reb, 1 block.
-Bryant doesn't pick up foul #4 for the rest of the game. So, during Bryant's time on the bench with fouls, Heytvelt went for 7 pts, 3 reb, 2 stls, 1 block. Not bad.
-Now let's look at how Heytvelt did for the entire game while Bryant was on the bench for any reason. Heytvelt went for 10 pts, 6 reb, 2 stls, 1 block. Take out these numbers, Heytvelt's line drops to 19 pts and 3 reb. I'd hardly call that "being owned."
-I'd also like to submit that Heytvelt is a F, while Bryant is a C. Six of Heytvelt's points came from 3 pointers, which are probably not Big John's fault.

FINAL CONCLUSION:
-The two games head-to-head between the two big men were a virtual wash. Who did better against the rest of the competition? Take a look at the WCC only stats below and you will see who had better numbers, thus POY award. Besides, you can't tell me that Heytvelt's "history" didn't play a part. And the fact that Bouldin might have taken a vote or two from him.

Average Stats, WCC games only:
Scoring
2. Bryant 18.0 ppg
4. Heytvelt 16.0 ppg

Rebounding
1. Bryant 15.1 rpg
8. Heytvelt 6.8 rpg

Offensive Rebounds
1. Bryant 4.29 rpg
10. Heytvelt 2.14 rpg

Defensive Rebounds
1. Bryant 10.86 rpg
7. Heytvelt 4.64 rpg

Field Goal %
1. Bryant .621
2. Heytvelt .566

Free Throw %
6. Bryant .747
8. Heytvelt .743

Blocked Shots
1. Bryant 2.43 bpg
10. Heytvelt 0.93 bpg

Double-Doubles
1. Bryant 13 (14 games total)
t-7. Heytvelt 2

BIG JOHN BRYANT LEADS JOSH HEYTVELT IN ALL CATEGORIES, PLACING FIRST IN THE WCC IN 6 OF THE 8 CATEGORIES LISTED

Das Zagger
03-04-2009, 02:22 PM
That's some might fine analysis right there (I'm sure that sounded smartalecky but I do mean it). Josh has come out on top in the one stat that matters, wins. SC is going to be a tough one come Sunday night, they will be gunning for GU (as all teams will, ask Mr. Mills about that).

I'm looking forward to this extended weekend.

lothar98zag
03-04-2009, 02:22 PM
SCU better win on Saturday!

zagfan08
03-04-2009, 02:24 PM
Josh's team went undefeated and Josh had much more talent surrounding him.

marczagfan
03-04-2009, 02:46 PM
If we are going to look at SCU and GU head to head....you better add Mr. Boldin into that mix.

Home against SCU.....16 pts, 5 reb, 4 ast, 2steals
At SCU....23 pts, 7 reb, 2 ast

I know they didn't guard each other, but there is a better argument for Boldin for POY than Heytfelt.

If you also want to compare Heyfelt to Bryant head to head, Josh had more points on the road against SCU (29) than bryant did combined in both meetings (28).

Bottom line is all 3 guys deserved a chance at player of the year, bryant had better overall numbers, but the zags were 14-0. You put Josh or Matt on SCU and they could put up big numbers as well. I am sure Big John would gladly give up POY to play with the zags and a shot at a deep run in March or to take SCU to the tourney. The fact that we can even discuss that 2 zags were in consideration for POY is a great thing!

tobizag
03-04-2009, 02:58 PM
If we are going to look at SCU and GU head to head....you better add Mr. Boldin into that mix.

Home against SCU.....16 pts, 5 reb, 4 ast, 2steals
At SCU....23 pts, 7 reb, 2 ast

I know they didn't guard each other, but there is a better argument for Boldin for POY than Heytfelt.

If you also want to compare Heyfelt to Bryant head to head, Josh had more points on the road against SCU (29) than bryant did combined in both meetings (28).

Bottom line is all 3 guys deserved a chance at player of the year, bryant had better overall numbers, but the zags were 14-0. You put Josh or Matt on SCU and they could put up big numbers as well. I am sure Big John would gladly give up POY to play with the zags and a shot at a deep run in March or to take SCU to the tourney. The fact that we can even discuss that 2 zags were in consideration for POY is a great thing!

:clap:

theirishzag03
03-04-2009, 03:10 PM
Spreading the wealth...

Zags...Heytvelt -15.2ppg, MB-13.8, AD-12.6, JP-9.6, SG-9.2, and MD-8.8

Broncs..Bryant-18.0ppg, Foster-14.5, Rahon-11.2, Trasolini-6.4, Petty-6.0, Santos-3.4, White-3.4

Just to compare the talent around them. Bryant 31.0 mpg, and 11.4 shots/game

Josh 28.8 mpg and 10.2 shots per game. They are very close statistically, so I believe you have to go with who's team had the better record. If SC was a close 2nd in the league, sure, I could see it. But it is a LOT easier to be the best player on the (7-7) 4th place team than the head and shoulders best player on a (14-0) conference champ.

If it was all about stats and not about leading the best team in the league, explain how Pargo won it last year?

patentram
03-04-2009, 03:16 PM
No MVP, No COY; No Problem, No losses in conference.

Let the folks who's season is over after this coming Tuesday have their individual honors and if it makes them feel better about themselves, great!

The Zags are focused on winning championships, they have one already and they are looking for two more.

GoZags
03-04-2009, 03:16 PM
If it was all about stats and not about leading the best team in the league, explain how Pargo won it last year?

I'm still wondering how Sean Dennisson won it (along with Derek) in '07. I don't have a problem w/ Bryant (he was my pick several weeks ago -- and then again late last week as I thought there'd be some vote splitting) as much as the COY -- who may have been "CO the 1st half of the season" when he had his guys playing for a tie for the league lead in the 8th game of the conference season. However, his guys went 3-4 the 2nd half of the WCC season, including getting swept the last weekend of the season.

A nice job? Yes. COY? Not in my opinion.

sharpzag
03-04-2009, 03:20 PM
These MVP arguments really come down to the same question all MVP arguments come down to.

Should MVP go to the best player on the best team? Or the player with the best stats. GU went 14-0 in conference. Without Josh Heytvelt, GU would have had no post presence whatsoever. Josh could easily score 20ppg in conference, but he instead chose to buy into the team concept and spread the wealth. Without Josh, GU would have struggled this year.

I think the WCC is just trying to get national recognition by making others aware that teams besides Gonzaga have good players/coaches.

jpwils
03-04-2009, 03:22 PM
Sorry to disagree with the John Bryant POY in WCC contingent but if Bryant was so awesome, why didn't they beat St Mary's at St Mary's???

Also even after Patty mills went down, Bryant didn't dominate the top 2 teams-SMC or Gonzaga. The above poster makes the point that Bryant is a true center and Josh is a power forward, which i actually agree with.
Therefore WHY didn't Bryant dominate a power forward ... he clearly was a bigger person in size but couldn't even dominate a guy who is more ideally suited to play the 4???

That is exactly why Heytvelt deserves POY more than Bryant.

webspinnre
03-04-2009, 03:24 PM
I'm a believer that player of the year goes to the person who played the best, i.e. best stats. In that case, it goes to Bryant, with Bouldin being a close second. I've got no problem with the conference awards. As long as we win the regular season and conference tourney, does anything else really matter?

Angelo Roncalli
03-04-2009, 03:29 PM
I've got no huge problem with Bryant being POY. Good cases can be made for both Bouldin and Heytvelt.

COY is another story. The measure of a team and its coach in conference play is how well the team does on the road. Any team can win at home, it's road games that separate the men from the boys. Portland had a great home record, but the only conference road games the Pilots won were against the three WCC cellar dwellers...LMU, Pepperdine and USF. Portland lost on the road to GU, SCU, USD and SMC. In the last weekend of the season, Portland dropped from 2nd to 3rd place in the WCC standings and earned an extra game at the WCC tournament. Reveno, for all the tremendous improvement he worked with the Pilots this year, couldn't get his team over the hump in road games against the good teams in the conference.

StocktonIsMyHero
03-04-2009, 03:51 PM
Fair enough points re: the COY debate, but really... Few has won it so many times... don't you think maybe the other WCC coaches thought it was great that Portland - who, lets be honest, no one expected anything from - had its first winning record in who knows how long and was right up there in the WCC all season long?

I mean... I don't know, does no one really think having Portland (Portland!) finish third with the lack of talent they have was maybe more difficult than steering a Zag ship that was at one point ranked Top 5 and didn't have to deal with Pat Mills or Brandon Johnson? I don't know, I mean... 14-0 is 14-0, but he HAS won it 7 out of the last 8 years.

I have no problem with the WCC coaches honoring a guy in Reveno who built up a program that hasn't really ever been anything.

lothar98zag
03-04-2009, 04:16 PM
this has been posted before, but in case anyone is still curious, here are the rules on voting for the conference awards:
http://www.netitor.com/photos/schools/west/genrel/auto_pdf/sport-regs-082907.pdf

see pages 54 & 55 (18 & 19 of 69)

freezer12
03-04-2009, 07:15 PM
If we are going to look at SCU and GU head to head....you better add Mr. Boldin into that mix.

I realize that Bouldin had a great argument for POY. This was simply to dispel the notion that Heytvelt was better than Bryant in 2009.

Nevtelen
03-04-2009, 07:35 PM
I agree that it comes down to a stats vs team argument - do you take someone off the best team or the player with the best stats. I tend to think you take the guy with the best stats. There's already a best team award - it's called a championship. Bryant clearly has better stats than Josh overall. Great analysis by freezer on the h-t-h match-ups, as well. In that way, I don't have any issues with the POY vote, though Bouldin and Josh both had legit cases. Every year 2 or 3 guys with legit cases get passed over for POY. It happens. In the past, it's pretty traditionally been the best player on the best team in the WCC. If the coaches decided to go the other way this season and give it to the guy with the best overall stats, that's still a legit way to decide the award.

gu03alum
03-04-2009, 07:43 PM
When doing your analysis, how can you throw out the times that Bryant sat on the bench with fouls? Isn't the ability to stay in the game part of being player of the year? You can't just say Josh's numbers don't count because he was smarter than Bryant and didn't foul as much. I think that makes the case better for Josh. He stayed out of foul trouble which allowed for him to take advantage of a weaker player when Bryant was sitting due to foul trouble.

HOOTER
03-04-2009, 07:47 PM
Let the rest of the conference celebrate it's mediocrity, we're 14-0. That's better than POY or COY any day.

zag buddy
03-04-2009, 08:07 PM
Put Josh on a weak team and he would be a superstar.

Zag79
03-04-2009, 08:34 PM
BIG JOHN BRYANT LEADS JOSH HEYTVELT IN ALL CATEGORIES, PLACING FIRST IN THE WCC IN 6 OF THE 8 CATEGORIES LISTED

:explode:

hes also the only guy on the team whos any good. if you put josh, matt, jeremy, micah or daye on SCU they have great stats and could win POY as well then. the best team should get the award. bryant wasnt dominant enough to house the trophy over a team full of players as good if not better but spreading the wealth. give me josh anyday.

Ezag
03-04-2009, 09:12 PM
Put Josh on a weak team and he would be a superstar.

Exactly! Put Josh on SC and he would've defintely put up better numbers than Bryant

freezer12
03-05-2009, 03:53 AM
When doing your analysis, how can you throw out the times that Bryant sat on the bench with fouls? Isn't the ability to stay in the game part of being player of the year? You can't just say Josh's numbers don't count because he was smarter than Bryant and didn't foul as much. I think that makes the case better for Josh. He stayed out of foul trouble which allowed for him to take advantage of a weaker player when Bryant was sitting due to foul trouble.

I throw out the fouls because it's a head-to-head analysis. Also, just because Josh didn't pick up fouls, he's smarter? Fouls are called subjectively and you can't honestly tell me that you think WCC refs are good. After watching Bryant for four years, I can tell you that he's at a disadvantage in the foul call department because he's so large. Many players flop off of him to get fouls called. Josh attempted this, as well. Remember when Josh fell down and then Bryant rolled his ankle? On that play, Josh flopped harder than Mallon, and that's saying something.

It's also is pretty ridiculous that Bryant shot only 4 free throws in two games. Once again, because he's so large, most WCC refs will not call contact fouls when he's shooting the ball. It's just hard to tell when contact is made with Bryant because of his size.

freezer12
03-05-2009, 03:56 AM
:explode:

hes also the only guy on the team whos any good. if you put josh, matt, jeremy, micah or daye on SCU they have great stats and could win POY as well then. the best team should get the award. bryant wasnt dominant enough to house the trophy over a team full of players as good if not better but spreading the wealth. give me josh anyday.

Yeah, the Newcomer of the Year was TERRIBLE! The two others on the WCC Freshman team were terrible, too! This statement is either dumb or ignorant or both.

FuManShoes
03-05-2009, 05:48 AM
Josh could easily score 20ppg in conference, but he instead chose to buy into the team concept and spread the wealth. Without Josh, GU would have struggled this year.



I actually think Josh thrived and the Zags became a better team once his teammates bought into him and got him more touches. With the weapons the Zags have, Josh doesn't usually get double-teamed and thus he has an advantage whenever he gets the ball. But early on he wasn't getting the ball nearly enough. Once that was rectified the Zags offense seemed to run much better, because either Josh was scoring or cleaning up around the glass or taking his man outside or opening things up for Bouldin to drive or shoot. If anything, I think Austin is the one who had to buy into things a bit and look to pass more instead of shoot every time he got the ball.

WallaWallaZag
03-05-2009, 06:05 AM
Yeah, the Newcomer of the Year was TERRIBLE! The two others on the WCC Freshman team were terrible, too! This statement is either dumb or ignorant or both.

i don't think anyone is saying that they're so terrible...on the other hand, if they're so good, why is santa clara 7-7 in a weak conference with a losing record overall including losses to some truly awful teams...florida atlantic??? they're worse than usc-upstate!!! yes, early season, but still...

having said that, i don't really have a big problem with bryant winning mvp...on the other hand, an mvp caliber player should be able to lead his team to more wins, especially as you point out with 3 all-conference freshman. just an example, but i think stephen curry has less to work with in terms of teammates, but he makes those around him better. does big john do that? ...not sure.

gu03alum
03-05-2009, 07:38 AM
I throw out the fouls because it's a head-to-head analysis. Also, just because Josh didn't pick up fouls, he's smarter? Fouls are called subjectively and you can't honestly tell me that you think WCC refs are good. After watching Bryant for four years, I can tell you that he's at a disadvantage in the foul call department because he's so large. Many players flop off of him to get fouls called. Josh attempted this, as well. Remember when Josh fell down and then Bryant rolled his ankle? On that play, Josh flopped harder than Mallon, and that's saying something.

It's also is pretty ridiculous that Bryant shot only 4 free throws in two games. Once again, because he's so large, most WCC refs will not call contact fouls when he's shooting the ball. It's just hard to tell when contact is made with Bryant because of his size.

Wow, you are full of excuses for Bryant. He's so big that he's at a disadvantage. What?!! I have never heard that excuse before.

Please give credit where credit is due. Josh OUTPLAYED Bryant in the second game. You cannot deny this.

NJZag
03-05-2009, 07:57 AM
I'm a believer that player of the year goes to the person who played the best, i.e. best stats. In that case, it goes to Bryant, with Bouldin being a close second. I've got no problem with the conference awards. As long as we win the regular season and conference tourney, does anything else really matter?

I don't know what it would have said about our conference if someone who stayed ranked consistently high, not only in conference stats but nationwide stats, had been overlooked for the second year in a row. Until looking at the guidelines for voting, it had been my assumption that the best player on the regular season championship team or at least the #2 team in WCC play had to be the pick; therefore the long succession of Zags players over the past decade as POYs. Pargo's merit for POY was being debated last year, and the weight of the team's ranking seems to have been agreed to be the decisive factor. But that's an informal tradition and not mandatory. It's kind of hard to argue with this ...

http://collegehoopsnet.com/wcc-all-conference-team-bryant-poy-165890


SAN BRUNO, Calif. -- Santa Clara senior center John Bryant turned in one of the most dominating seasons in the last 30 years in WCC history and was rewarded on Monday by being named the Conference Player of the Year in a vote by the league's head coaches. Saint Mary's senior forward Diamon Simpson joined Bryant among the yearly conference award recipients, taking home his second consecutive Defensive Player of the Year honor. Santa Clara's Kevin Foster and Portland's T.J. Campbell shared the Newcomer of the Year award, while Portland Head Coach Eric Reveno was named the Coach of the Year.

Bryant, who is the eighth different Santa Clara player to earn WCC's top honor, was an immovable force during conference play, ranking second in the league in scoring with 18.0 points per game to go along with a staggering 15.1 rebounds per game. Bryant's 15.1 rpg average is the highest clip in the WCC since former San Francisco standout Bill Cartwright averaged 16.1 rpg during the 1978-79 season .

In addition, the San Pablo, CA native also paced the conference in field goal percentage (.621) and blocked shots (34) . Bryant currently leads the nation in overall rebounds (430), double-doubles (24), and 20-point/20-rebound games (5).

Yes, it's "harder" to put up big stats if someone is surrounded by more of a stellar team, although offensively, the "feed Ammo" strategy allowed for that even on a talented team in the past. But more often, perhaps, the reward for being on a stellar team lies in the post-season. I have no problems with the WCC looking at players on their own merits for end of season awards, since I think it's good for the WCC overall as teams look to recruit better and improve the league's standing overall.

So I give the 2009 POY his due, no gripes or quibbles. Others have (http://keithyp.blogspot.com/2009/02/this-weeks-most-underrated-mens-college.html), as they looked at some of the reasons his overall percentage in scoring was noteworthy, considering the double and triple teaming he often faced in games, and predicted he had an NBA future.


http://cache.daylife.com/imageserve/0e5T4ok4I25Lx/340x.jpg

:allhail:



2009 WCC CONFERENCE HONORS

Player of the Year
John Bryant, SCU

Defensive Player of the Year
Diamon Simpson, SMC

Co-Newcomer of the Year
T.J. Campbell, POR
Kevin Foster, SCU

Coach of the Year
Eric Reveno, POR

All-WCC First Team
Matt Bouldin, GON - JR - G
John Bryant, SCU - SR - C
T.J. Campbell, POR - JR - G
Josh Heytvelt, GON - SR - C
Dior Lowhorn, USF - JR - F
Patrick Mills, SMC - SO - G
Gyno Pomare, USD - SR - F/C
Nik Raivio, POR - JR - G
Omar Samhan, SMC - JR - C
Diamon Simpson, SMC - SR - F

All-WCC Freshman Team
Keion Bell, PEP - G
Jarred DuBois, LMU - G
Kevin Foster, SCU - G
James Rahon, SCU - G
Marc Trasolini, SCU - F

All-WCC Honorable Mention
Austin Daye, GON - SO - F
Kevin Foster, SCU - FR - G
Steven Gray, GON - SO - G
Jeremy Pargo, GON - SR - G
Robin Smeulders, POR - JR - F
Jared Stohl, POR - SO - G

EngineerZag
03-05-2009, 03:19 PM
If Bryant had been a truly dominating player (25 ppg+) I could kinda see him getting the POY even though he was on a 7-7 team. But when his stats are barely better than TWO of the players on the 14-0 team, it doesn't make sense to me.

StocktonIsMyHero
03-05-2009, 03:55 PM
If Bryant had been a truly dominating player (25 ppg+) I could kinda see him getting the POY even though he was on a 7-7 team. But when his stats are barely better than TWO of the players on the 14-0 team, it doesn't make sense to me.

Barely better? Josh doesn't beat Bryant in a single category and is significantly worse in rebounding and blocks. Bouldin beats Bryant in assists and assist/TO ratio, but obviously Bryant's position pretty much precludes him from those categories.

And when you think about it, Gonzaga's defensive FG% is so good that rebounds should be really easy to come by for Josh. Yet Bryant averages more than twice as many as Heytvelt.

Look, you can argue that because Gonzaga went 14-0 and finished first they should have won the POY, but let's not pretend that Bryant wasn't leaps and bounds better statistically than anyone else in the league.

In WCC play...

Scoring
Bryant: 18.0 pg (2nd in WCC)
Heytvelt: 16.0 pg (4th in WCC)
Bouldin: 15.4 pg (5th in WCC)

Rebounding
Bryant: 15.1 pg (1st in WCC, 1st in nation)
Heytvelt: 6.8 ppg (8th in WCC)
Bouldin: Not in Top 15

Fielg Goal %
Bryant: .621 (1st in WCC)
Heytvelt: .566 (2nd in WCC)
Bouldin: .532 (7th in WCC)

Blocked Shots
Bryant: 2.34 pg (1st in WCC)
Heytvelt: 0.93 (10th in WCC)
Bouldin: Not in Top 15

Free Throw %
Bryant: .747 (6th in WCC)
Heytvelt: .743 (8th in WCC)
Bouldin: .720 (12th in WCC)

lothar98zag
03-05-2009, 04:05 PM
...Josh doesn't beat Bryant in a single category...

Not true

Offensive Rating
JH - 121.6
JB - 118.2

3 ptrs made
JH - 21
JB - 0

:D

EngineerZag
03-05-2009, 04:12 PM
The stats you posted prove my point. Bryant averaged, wow, 2 ppg more than Josh. He rebounded a lot better, I'll concede that point. But it's not like we're talking about an All-American candidate that happened to be on a 7-7 team. Bryant's numbers don't blow Josh's away (or Bouldin's) ... they are *slightly* better. And that's why I think it's silly to give the POY to him when he's on a 7-7 team. You say Bryant's position "precludes him" from having better assist numbers, Josh's position as a 4 precludes him from getting more rebounds, and it also lowers his FG % slightly because he shoots 3s and mid range shots, having many more offensive weapons in his arsenal than Big John. As others have pointed out, Josh's stats would be through the roof if he was on the SCU team, and Josh is clearly the better player. (I'd take him on my team any day over Bryant, wouldn't you?)

The main reason this irks me is that GU showed itself to be clearly head and shoulders above the league this year (14-0 and the next team down was 10-4) and yet we don't take POY, COY, or anything ... probably because the other coaches are tired of Zag dominance, but is that a reason to take the award away from a very deserving senior like Josh???

Zag79
03-05-2009, 09:23 PM
Yeah, the Newcomer of the Year was TERRIBLE! The two others on the WCC Freshman team were terrible, too! This statement is either dumb or ignorant or both.

I'll tell you whats dumb AND ignorant to me. A 10 minute post about why Josh isnt POY. Comparing a player from a 7-7 team who has to do everything thus has inflated stats, to Josh whos on the undefeated team stacked with players that spread stats thin is too funny. If Josh and John switched teams im sure the POY award would have gone the other way. Josh has more moves, a much better shot selection, and even plays better D. What more do you want? He also plays a different style than John. We can agree to disagree and ill ride Josh to march madness!


And that's why I think it's silly to give the POY to him when he's on a 7-7 team. You say Bryant's position "precludes him" from having better assist numbers, Josh's position as a 4 precludes him from getting more rebounds, and it also lowers his FG % slightly because he shoots 3s and mid range shots, having many more offensive weapons in his arsenal than Big John. As others have pointed out, Josh's stats would be through the roof if he was on the SCU team, and Josh is clearly the better player. (I'd take him on my team any day over Bryant, wouldn't you?)

BINGO...