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View Full Version : Aaron Dotson'S TOP-3



Butler Guy
06-18-2008, 08:53 AM
The Seattle native says he plans to make a decision by the "end of the summer." With the official start of summer just a couple days away, we asked Dotson if any schools have the early edge.

"Indiana, Kansas and Miami (http://rivalshoops.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=818849)," said Dotson.

ziggarut
06-18-2008, 09:11 AM
Don't know anything about Dotson, BUT the fact that 2 out of his top 3 school choices are Indiana (ugh, what a mess) and Miami (felon U), make me suspect that he is NOT Zag material.

LongIslandZagFan
06-18-2008, 09:27 AM
Don't know anything about Dotson, BUT the fact that 2 out of his top 3 school choices are Indiana (ugh, what a mess) and Miami (felon U), make me suspect that he is NOT Zag material.

How could Kansas NOT win with that bunch?

StocktonIsMyHero
06-18-2008, 09:44 AM
Don't know anything about Dotson, BUT the fact that 2 out of his top 3 school choices are Indiana (ugh, what a mess) and Miami (felon U), make me suspect that he is NOT Zag material.

This is probably one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen. Tom Crean is an excellent coach and an excellent person, and Kelvin Sampson's misbehaviors should in no way reflect on him. I can't imagine anyone calling him or his program into question.

As for Miami... their basketball program is on the rise and had a nice win over Saint Mary's in the NCAAs this past season. Frank Haith is a terrific coach and has improved Miami's win total every year, including three straight post-season tournaments from 06-08. Most pundits thought they would be the laughing stock of the ACC when the moved into it in 04-05, but Haith proved them all wrong. Not only that, but he has graduated all of his players that didn't transfer out during the coaching change. Completely ludicrous to associate Haith's program with the problems of their football team.

I get what "Zag Material" is supposed to mean, but I think any moral high ground that existed kind of went away with the Josh and Theo thing. In my opinion, it's absolutely unfair to say a kid isn't "Zag Material" (i.e. an aw-shucks good kid who plays hard, loves the game, good in the classroom, classy, etc. etc.) because he listed a school whose previous coach had problems and a school whose football program has had some issues.

I mean... if you're hinting that the kid must be a thug and a bad seed to be interested in those schools, why not just come out and say it instead of hiding behind "Zag Material"?

BobZag
06-18-2008, 09:49 AM
Agreed, Hero.

LongIslandZagFan
06-18-2008, 09:52 AM
This is probably one of the most ridiculous posts I've ever seen. Tom Crean is an excellent coach and an excellent person, and Kelvin Sampson's misbehaviors should in no way reflect on him. I can't imagine anyone calling him or his program into question.

As for Miami... their basketball program is on the rise and had a nice win over Saint Mary's in the NCAAs this past season. Frank Haith is a terrific coach and has improved Miami's win total every year, including three straight post-season tournaments from 06-08. Most pundits thought they would be the laughing stock of the ACC when the moved into it in 04-05, but Haith proved them all wrong. Not only that, but he has graduated all of his players that didn't transfer out during the coaching change. Completely ludicrous to associate Haith's program with the problems of their football team.

I get what "Zag Material" is supposed to mean, but I think any moral high ground that existed kind of went away with the Josh and Theo thing. In my opinion, it's absolutely unfair to say a kid isn't "Zag Material" (i.e. an aw-shucks good kid who plays hard, loves the game, good in the classroom, classy, etc. etc.) because he listed a school whose previous coach had problems and a school whose football program has had some issues.

I mean... if you're hinting that the kid must be a thug and a bad seed to be interested in those schools, why not just come out and say it instead of hiding behind "Zag Material"?

I think the point with Indiana is that they could be looking at sanctions. That hurts the program regardless of how good the coach is... ask Coach Monson. Can't say I disagree on Miami, but I think the schools ethics are questionable period when it comes to sports... guilt by association, maybe, but it is what it is.

BroncoZAG615
06-18-2008, 10:07 AM
The whole "Zag Material" thing has gotten a little bit out of hand.

If I ran the internet message board world I would ban phrases like "Zag material", "Zag qualities", "Mr. Zag" and the sort.

What it all comes down to is basketball. We are not recruiting mentors for inner city kids, we are recruiting the best basketball players. I'm sure that many of the players that we have paraded around and showered with affection have had moments where they weren't on their best behavior but don't get caught. College kids do college things, some get caught, some don't. I'm sure we have all had moments where we say "Damn, I'm glad I didn't get caught doing that"

Does Josh and Theo getting caught make them any less "Zag material"? Absolutely not. They are Zags when they come in the door and Zags whenever they leave. If Few trusts to recruit them and forgive them for shortcomings then that is good enough for me and should be enough for everyone.

The only reason Aaron Dotson is not Zag material is because he chose not to come here. Recruit the best players you can the fit your program, personality included. Everyone needs to try and come down from their high horse for a little while.

Indiana and Miami are very good four year institutions with good CURRENT leadership.

theothegreat21
06-18-2008, 10:15 AM
2 thoughts on this thread

1) Dotson not listing GU really isnt that big of deal. Dotson is a very solid player, but with Arop already verballed, and our pursuit of both of the Marshall's (Anthony and Henderson), we would be getting a better guard. Dotson is a solid prospect, but he is not a player that we will regret not having. Also, Indiana has a great new head coach who can promise immediate playing time, and Frank Haith has a very solid program at Miami.

2) Broncozag nailed his post. This whole idea of Zag Material is long dated, and it is time to stop using terms and ideals like this. The type of player that started this great run, is no longer the type of player that we are going to find at this university, and this isnt a bad thing. Because of the popularity and success that GU has attained, we are able to get more high profile and more talented recruits. There is this nostalgia for the player's of the past, becuase everyone seems to remember them in this great shining light. However, I think that it is time to start embracing the type of talent that Few and the staff our recruiting. I hope this season, we will no longer see people questioning certain player's work ethics, hustle, and mental toughness. I assure that this team has player's with great work ethic, who are willing to hustle, and who are as mentally tough as anyone who has ever been in the program

wiszag
06-18-2008, 10:22 AM
The two words that guarantee that I'll quit reading the post are "Zag Material." Those words carry a stench of arrogance that I'm unable to withstand.

75Zag
06-18-2008, 10:23 AM
This is more of a general comment than about Dotson specifically or any of the preceding posts, but it seems that many Zag fans act like a "scorned lover" when it comes to recruiting failures. During the recruiting period you see and hear many positive and hopeful comments about the various players that GU hopes to recruit. But once a player selects somebody else, it takes about ten seconds before you hear the direct and indirect negative comments.

Good luck to young Mr. Dotson wherever he decides to go. He would have been a great catch, but with or without him or any other specific recruiting target, GU will continue to build a great program with great players who choose to come to a great school.

HillBillyZag
06-18-2008, 11:02 AM
Without starting a riot I must beg to diagree with you on the "Zag Material" question. Its exact meaning could be different for different people. In my own case case it would mean a player whose goals are team oriented, ie..winning games, winning the WCC Championship, and winning the Div.1 Mens NCAA Championship, if possible. A player who hopefully would not act in a way to embarress themselves, their team-mates or the University. A player who is not only a good athlete, but a good student. And before you ask, I don't considerthat the incident with Josh reflects anything other than a good kid who used bad judgement. I would find it hard to consider a young man whose three favorite words were I, ME, and MINE, who would lie, cheat, steal and in general act like a hooligan, to be "Zag material. Such a kid would not be recruited by Coach Few and his staff or tolerated by the University. So in my estimation being a Zag is not elitest, its basically just doing whats right. I am made to think that some of you would recruit an axe murderer if you thought he could get us to the final four.(lol) Now thats a gross exaggeration, but truthfully in my mind, character,personality, and common sense should be required of any prospective Gonzaga student athlete, the job of a Catholic University is to prepare young people to succeed in LIFE, not just in their sport.

cjm720
06-18-2008, 11:08 AM
Mark Few and Company have to look at a player beyond basketball skills solely, right? It seems quite ridiculous to think that leadership and character don't play a large role in any kind of recruiting decision. You can call that what you want.

CDC84
06-18-2008, 11:25 AM
This is more of a general comment than about Dotson specifically or any of the preceding posts, but it seems that many Zag fans act like a "scorned lover" when it comes to recruiting failures.

If you think it's bad here, you should check out the fan sites of BCS teams who lose recruits to Gonzaga. This kind of thing happens at just about every fan site on the internet that discusses recruiting related to a specific school.

I can verify that the "scorned lover" thing is not applicable to Dotson. Gonzaga's interest in him apparently diminished with the Arop verbal. Now if Abdul Gaddy or Josh Smith end up verbaling to schools other than Gonzaga......it's a different story. Jordan Farmar, Deon Thompson, Luke Ridenour, Brandon Roy....same deal. Gonzaga definitely wants or wanted those players.

ziggarut
06-18-2008, 12:17 PM
What I posted was a joke based on certain realities so mellow out people. The overreactions and emotional responses to a joke are the reasons why I try not to post on this site and won't in the future.

Point is Indiana is the SMU of college baskbetball for the next 3-6 years, and Miami, is, well, Miami. I don't care who the coach is, the school has a well deserved reputation for who they have recruited in the past 30 years. They made their own bed, so let them lie in it... Besides, it was a sarcastic JAB!!

And if there is some reality in any recruit, in the summer of 2008, listing Indiana and Miami as 2 of his top 3 choices, then maybe there is some reality in the quality of student athlete he is.

BESIDES, IT WAS A JOKE people!!

BroncoZAG615
06-18-2008, 01:45 PM
Without starting a riot I must beg to diagree with you on the "Zag Material" question. Its exact meaning could be different for different people. In my own case case it would mean a player whose goals are team oriented, ie..winning games, winning the WCC Championship, and winning the Div.1 Mens NCAA Championship, if possible. A player who hopefully would not act in a way to embarress themselves, their team-mates or the University. A player who is not only a good athlete, but a good student. And before you ask, I don't considerthat the incident with Josh reflects anything other than a good kid who used bad judgement. I would find it hard to consider a young man whose three favorite words were I, ME, and MINE, who would lie, cheat, steal and in general act like a hooligan, to be "Zag material. Such a kid would not be recruited by Coach Few and his staff or tolerated by the University. So in my estimation being a Zag is not elitest, its basically just doing whats right. I am made to think that some of you would recruit an axe murderer if you thought he could get us to the final four.(lol) Now thats a gross exaggeration, but truthfully in my mind, character,personality, and common sense should be required of any prospective Gonzaga student athlete, the job of a Catholic University is to prepare young people to succeed in LIFE, not just in their sport.

It's all a matter of personal opinion.

For me, "Zag material, Zagness, Zagity, Zagmanity etc" is complete hogwash to be honest. I can't stand the term. I'm sure I'll catch flack for this but for example if you look at Josh's situation, anyone could infer that this is not just some "oops" incident where it was his first and only time and he just got caught. Shrooms are definitely a relatively heavy drug and you would think he has had some experience in that area if you are looking at this realistically and objectively. So is that a case of bad judgment or where do you draw the line? I personally think Josh is good now and I totally forgive him but do I think he was the most upstanding citizen before? Probably not. So how does he fit into "Zag Material". It's a VERY thin line.

Kids are kids are kids are kids. Few does the best job at recruiting kids that will not embarass the program and will win games. Like I said before, many things are just on the basis of getting caught. Would I recruit an "axe murder"? Of course not. But if I was under the impression he was a relatively decent kid then I would :) .

The main reason I don't like the "Zag" related terms are because they tend to single players out and people think certain players are more "Zag" than others. Every Gonzaga basketball player has "Zag" qualities because they are Gonzaga basketball players. If a kid dives on the floor that just means he is a hustler. It doesn't mean he is more "Zag" then the guy who just scores 20 points a game but is not all over the floor diving around. As long as they contribute to GONZAGA...they are Zags.

Nevtelen
06-18-2008, 02:15 PM
Without starting a riot I must beg to diagree with you on the "Zag Material" question. Its exact meaning could be different for different people. In my own case case it would mean a player whose goals are team oriented, ie..winning games, winning the WCC Championship, and winning the Div.1 Mens NCAA Championship, if possible. A player who hopefully would not act in a way to embarress themselves, their team-mates or the University. A player who is not only a good athlete, but a good student. And before you ask, I don't considerthat the incident with Josh reflects anything other than a good kid who used bad judgement. I would find it hard to consider a young man whose three favorite words were I, ME, and MINE, who would lie, cheat, steal and in general act like a hooligan, to be "Zag material. Such a kid would not be recruited by Coach Few and his staff or tolerated by the University. So in my estimation being a Zag is not elitest, its basically just doing whats right. I am made to think that some of you would recruit an axe murderer if you thought he could get us to the final four.(lol) Now thats a gross exaggeration, but truthfully in my mind, character,personality, and common sense should be required of any prospective Gonzaga student athlete, the job of a Catholic University is to prepare young people to succeed in LIFE, not just in their sport.

In many ways, you are correct. Of course Few and Co look for kids of good character and work ethic, who are team oriented, etc. And I think they generally find them. My issue with the term is that it makes it feel like GU is the only school out there looking for kids like this (whether or not a poster beleives this, the association of "Zag" with these qualities creates that implied meaning). This is just not true. There are, certainly, programs who will take any kid as long as he plays ball well (Louisville and Caracter, anyone?) but many programs do their level best to avoid those situations. GU has done a great great job of that overall, and should be justifiably proud of the program's track record in that area. But equating good character/team orientedness with Zagdom specifically is a little silly IMO.

spudzag
06-18-2008, 03:21 PM
It's all a matter of personal opinion.



Can we can all agree with this quote?

:cheers:

HillBillyZag
06-18-2008, 03:27 PM
Notre Dame fans look for "Irish" material, Kentucky fans look for "wildcat"s.WSU looks for "cougars and Gonzaga looks for "Zags". Do I like other teams?, yes, do I LOVE Gonzaga,? YES, there is a difference. Like the ole country song, "you've got to stand for something, or you'll fall for anything!"

BobZag
06-18-2008, 03:28 PM
The staff chose Mangisto Arop over Dotson. Much ado about nothing here.

MDABE80
06-18-2008, 05:12 PM
Nothing to make "message board enemies" over. We got our guy. AND we got a good one:) The End.