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Russell Bevan
05-27-2008, 07:23 PM
Gonzaga junior point Pargo, brother of New Orleans guard Jannero Pargo, is playing in the hope that he can crack the first round, if not get some sort of guarantee for the second round.

http://insider.espn.go.com/espn/blog/index?entryID=3413496&name=katz_andy

BobZag
05-28-2008, 08:52 AM
Is a 2nd-Round guarantee really worth anything? Just wondering.

StocktonIsMyHero
05-28-2008, 09:17 AM
Is a 2nd-Round guarantee really worth anything? Just wondering.

You're not serious, are you Bob? Just because a second-round pick isn't automatically guaranteed money doesn't mean they will automatically be kicked to the curb either. I don't think there was a single second-round pick who was just cut outright by the team that drafted them. That just doesn't happen.

If you are drafted in the second round, you are still going to get paid to play. And if you are drafted high in the second round, your agent can probably get you a two-year guaranteed deal anyway.

Guys that don't make the NBA roster right away still play in the D-League and are making the money from whatever contract they signed after being drafted.

But still, a lot of guys drafted in the second round do indeed play in the NBA. Just off the top of my head from this year: Carl Landry, Glen Davis, Gabe Pruitt, Ramon Sessions - all those guys had significant impacts. And the list of highly successful second-rounders is too long to even bother to put together.

Look, I know you don't want Pargo to leave... I don't think anyone does. But stop trying to be all paternal with him. If he wants to finally get paid to play after 16 or 17 years of playing basketball year-round, he has that right.

BobZag
05-28-2008, 09:35 AM
I wasn't aware that the 2nd-Round had any guarantees. That's why I asked. I don't follow it that closely. If Pargo can get guaranteed money, he should seriously consider it.

StocktonIsMyHero
05-28-2008, 09:43 AM
Well, I'm not expert either, and I don't want to come across as combative.

Technically, the money isn't guaranteed until rosters are finalized. (That is, unless the agent works our a guarantee in the deal itself, which is always possible.) But history has proved that teams just simply don't outright cut a guy before even giving him a look in at least the D-League. I mean... why draft a guy if you are just going to boot him three months later?

Interestingly, I heard the Blazers GM Kevin Pritchard talking about second round picks (the Blazers have three in this draft... and they need a PG... and they have awesome potential... might not be a bad spot for Pargo!) and he said that second round picks are totally unrestricted in the sense that teams are not locked into the first round salary scale. So, a team can draft a big Euro league star in the second round and give him a big guaranteed contract that could be worth more than even the contract for the top overall pick.

cjm720
05-28-2008, 09:57 AM
Second round selections have a ton of value to the right team as they can land a gem without having to pay up as much. That's almost becoming the norm because of the available talent around the country and globe.

But there's no second round guarantee. You are much better off being a 1st round selection. Just ask Dan Dickau.

JohnOGU
05-28-2008, 10:01 AM
to be honest, Pargo just isnt ready for the NBA. We all saw how inconsistant he has been. Even if he did play decent-well in the draft camp, im still not convinced based off of his skills that he is ready. He needs another year, and this isnt just because i want him to stay.

StocktonIsMyHero
05-28-2008, 10:02 AM
But there's no second round guarantee. You are much better off being a 1st round selection. Just ask Dan Dickau.

Agreed, for the most part.

But let's not overblow the guarantee. It's only a guaranteed two years with a first round pick. And since no teams very, very rarely cut second round picks before their first season (don't want to say never because it's probably happened at some point), a second round pick is basically a one-year guarantee.

And again, your agent can negotiate a guarantee too, even if you are a second round pick. For example:

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/basketball/celtics/view.bg?articleid=1029264

Both Davis and Pruitt got multi-year deals that were guaranteed before this season even began.

CDC84
05-28-2008, 10:05 AM
There is a difference between Pargo sneaking into the first round and getting a guaranteed 3 year contract according to the collective bargaining rules, and Pargo getting selected in the 2nd round by a team who has agreed, in principal, to pick him if he's available. But second round picks aren't guaranteed anything unless the player and his agent work out something with a team on their own. But many teams aren't willing to take that kind of risk on a 2nd round pick. However, as stocktonismyhero has pointed out, the presence the D-League virtually ensures that every player who gets drafted is going to get paid for playing at some level. The question is: how much? For me, this isn't an issue about whether Pargo is going to get drafted or not. It's a question of how much money he can make right from the get go.

I still think there is an argument to be made that Pargo is much better off waiting another year. The 2009 draft is just going to be awful, and if he improves at all, I could definitely see him being back end first round pick. I'd wait if I were him.

LongIslandZagFan
05-28-2008, 10:39 AM
I wasn't aware that the 2nd-Round had any guarantees. That's why I asked. I don't follow it that closely. If Pargo can get guaranteed money, he should seriously consider it.

They aren't guaranteed anything. Period. If they don't stick during the summer, they get absolutely nothing. Period. Agent or no agent. Making 30Gs in D-League is less than they could make at a real job.

thebigsmoove
05-28-2008, 11:27 AM
They aren't guaranteed anything. Period. If they don't stick during the summer, they get absolutely nothing. Period. Agent or no agent. Making 30Gs in D-League is less than they could make at a real job.

actually they are guaranteed a contract if their agent can strike up a deal, once the ink dries on that contract it is final, the team has to own up, so if pargo is told before the draft that he will be selected no later than portland or someone else due to their interest in the player and they are willing to offer a 2 year deal or a 1 year deal then pargo has a guarantee. its not legally binding, but most sign well before training camp or summer leagues, ala Big Baby davis. So yes their are guarantees. Secondly, regardless of whether pargo is ready or not, if someone wants to pick him then he is ready to be picked thats all that matters. His family has a history (Jannero) of playing in the NBA, so that counts for something when the scouts look at him for potential. I think Pargo would be picked somewhere between 25-50 if he were to come out this year. And i honestly think he would not stay in unless he was told he was a strong candidate to be picked.

cjm720
05-28-2008, 12:28 PM
actually they are guaranteed a contract if their agent can strike up a deal, once the ink dries on that contract it is final, the team has to own up, so if pargo is told before the draft that he will be selected no later than portland or someone else due to their interest in the player and they are willing to offer a 2 year deal or a 1 year deal then pargo has a guarantee. its not legally binding, but most sign well before training camp or summer leagues, ala Big Baby davis. So yes their are guarantees. Secondly, regardless of whether pargo is ready or not, if someone wants to pick him then he is ready to be picked thats all that matters. His family has a history (Jannero) of playing in the NBA, so that counts for something when the scouts look at him for potential. I think Pargo would be picked somewhere between 25-50 if he were to come out this year. And i honestly think he would not stay in unless he was told he was a strong candidate to be picked.

Your guarantees are littered with "ifs," as in there are no second round guarantees. Period. The issue he faces is whether to decide by June 16th to stay in the draft. Your suppositions relate to after the draft. A verbal guarantee that he will be drafted is lip service esepcially when a better player falls to that team. Your Big Baby example is not the norm.

jayray
05-29-2008, 12:36 PM
I didn't read the article - are they saying he is a for sure 2nd rounder? Isn't there still a likely chance no one will pick him up if he decides to go for it?

jigga5
05-29-2008, 01:48 PM
I think Pargo is being really dumb if he stays.... I don't know how many people need to tell him how weak the PG situation is going to be next year. It makes me wonder if he is unhappy at GU ? He does not need the money for his family because his older bro is already in the L. Makes no sense

MedZag
05-29-2008, 02:03 PM
I think Pargo is being really dumb if he stays.... I don't know how many people need to tell him how weak the PG situation is going to be next year. It makes me wonder if he is unhappy at GU ? He does not need the money for his family because his older bro is already in the L. Makes no sense

P is not unhappy at GU. Jannero is telling him to wait. But little brothers gotta be their own person too. This is solely P's decison.

He's dreamt of playing in the NBA his entire life. When something you've wanted so bad for so long is right there in front of you, it's mighty tempting, no matter what round or what draft year or whatever. That doesn't make him dumb.

He's still on the fence, and Few knows that. The NBA draft bloggers really try to sell that these kids are going because it makes for more intriguing pre-draft coverage.

CDC84
05-29-2008, 02:27 PM
The one thing I do know about Jeremy is that anything Coach Few says will be taken seriously. There is a lot of mutual respect between those two.

MDABE80
05-29-2008, 02:37 PM
I wanted to be a full professor at Harvard when I was 22 Med. Turns out, the place was awful.........so I went to UCLA. We get what we ask for but we don't always get what we want. We just get what we need..and wonder what that earlier "dream" was all about....moreso when we cross 40 yrs of age;)

Jeremy......especially after that publicized mess yesterday in Orlando...should reaffirm his intentions to be the best PG in college next year and let his ego rest a bit. He needs work at this point....not some dream that won't happen right now. Usually if you force it, it won't happen....just words of wisdom.

theothegreat21
05-29-2008, 03:45 PM
http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10844747

I just wanted to post this, because whether or not we think that Jeremy should be going to the NBA or not, we should all support him and remeber that it is his decision and his life.

ZagMania
05-29-2008, 03:56 PM
Jeremy......especially after that publicized mess yesterday in Orlando...should reaffirm his intentions to be the best PG in college next year and let his ego rest a bit.

Oh, come on it was only 14 minutes of play or something like that. One day isn't going to kill his stock. Sure, from what I can tell there is a good argument to stay, but I'm sure he's taking everything into consideration and he'll make the best personal decision for himself.

MedZag
05-29-2008, 05:47 PM
http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10844747

I just wanted to post this, because whether or not we think that Jeremy should be going to the NBA or not, we should all support him and remeber that it is his decision and his life.

What a sad article.

Reborn
05-29-2008, 06:09 PM
I really like this article, and it really discloses a lot of truth about fans. There wasn't much that surprised me, I'll say that. I hope we all gain a lot of insite from this, as we move into a new era of Zag basketball. Gonzaga fans are extremely loyal, and I believe it's a fantastic selling point for the university. However, in general the Zags have not had to deal an awful lot with players leaving early, and this may begin to happen more. I appreciate Lawson's openness, and candor.

I hope we will NOT treat Jeremy that way if he decides to go. I think it's really great that Few, and maybe another coach, are there with Jeremy. I just really admire Few. This has got to be a rough time for Pargo, and the support of his coaches must really make him feel good. I agree with the reporter who puts few in the highest class of coaches. This will only help our recruiting, and I'm sure that Few is our best selling point to high school kids and their mothers.

Best of luck to Pargo. I'm behind you 100% in whatever decision you make. You've given me plenty the last two years. My grandson loves you, and wears his Pargo jersey frequently with pride. What else could anyone ask for. The greatest gift our athletes give us is the hope they give to our kids and grandkids. Not a better role model in my opinion. Again thanks, Jeremy.

ZagNative
05-29-2008, 06:52 PM
http://www.sportsline.com/collegebasketball/story/10844747

I just wanted to post this, because whether or not we think that Jeremy should be going to the NBA or not, we should all support him and remeber that it is his decision and his life.Thanks, Theo. From that story, about Ty Lawson:

LAKE BUENA VISTA, Fla. -- Ty Lawson is used to being encouraged by North Carolina fans.

That's why the past month has been discouraging for the sophomore point guard.

"I don't think more than five people have said 'I hope you do well' or things like that," Lawson said Tuesday night after his initial workout here at the NBA Pre-Draft Camp. "Most of the people are saying 'You'll only be like the 25th pick' or something like that, which makes me (wonder) 'Why should I go back?'"

Fans can turn on you quickly. I just wish Jeremy all the best. My twisted view is that I can't lose here: If Jeremy does well in the camp, I'm happy and proud and hopeful for him that he finds a good position in the NBA.

If he doesn't do well, I'm disappointed for him but happy if it increases the chance I'll see him in a Zag uniform again. I just don't want anything bad to happen to him, especially to make a decision that costs him the chance to fulfill his dreams.

I'm confident that he's receiving good advice, from Coach Few and from his brother. It's a big, big decision, and it occurred to me that I needed to just stop for a moment and say a little prayer for JP that he makes the best decision for himself. He sure has done his best to do all that the coaching staff has asked of him at Gonzaga, and I believe he has amply repaid Gonzaga for the chance they gave him and the training he received here. He's just been a blast to watch these past three years.

So, "Here's one for you, Jeremy!" :pray:

BTW, here are a couple of pics of JP from the predraft camp that I found on line this afternoon:

Defending against UAB's Robert Vaden as he drives to the basket Tuesday, May 27, 2008:

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff232/ZagNative/Zags/Pargo/2008-05-27JeremyNAPredraftcampwithR.jpg

And another one, of JP looking to pass on Wednesday, May 28, 2008:

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff232/ZagNative/Zags/Pargo/2008-05-29JeremyPredraftcampSRAPSto.jpg

MBZags
05-29-2008, 07:30 PM
That top pictures doesn't look like Jeremy to me.

ZagNative
05-29-2008, 07:43 PM
Really? The guy on the left? It looks like Jeremy to me. Dunno. Here's the link to the photo source (http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/photo?slug=717da5038bf14015955a8c71284fd67f.nba_pr e_draft_camp_basketball_flrm104&prov=ap).

Good excuse to post a comparative photo:

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff232/ZagNative/Zags/Pargo/Pargo-WSU06-BattlesLowe.jpg

BTW, Derrick Low is scheduled to work out with the Nets (http://njmg.typepad.com/zzone/2008/05/nets-draft-work.html) next week. Good luck Derrick!

MedZag
05-29-2008, 07:48 PM
Really? The guy on the left? It looks like Jeremy to me.

Except the guys got facial hair.

theothegreat21
05-29-2008, 10:13 PM
The guy guarding Robert Vaden is Joe Crawford from Kentucky.

ZagNative
05-29-2008, 10:30 PM
Obviously fooled me, not the first time a caption writer did that.

zagfan07
05-30-2008, 08:55 AM
Here's the link to the article on ESPN.com. I didn't see it posted in the thread. http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=3418506