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tyra
03-07-2007, 06:56 AM
OK, so while we're biding time for the Dance, here's a question: Who among our incoming and incredible class will get the most playing time? Austin Daye (virtually everyone's most-excited-about nominee)? Rob Sacre, the true 7 foot center? Ira Brown, the 25 year old cc transfer who seems to do it all? Or Steven Gray, this year's state scoring champ and phenom? With all the returning talent we have, will ANY of these freshmen get a lot of playing time? Who? And why?

CDC84
03-07-2007, 07:21 AM
Steven Gray

But the others will get their fair share of minutes.

zagster318
03-07-2007, 08:06 AM
My guess would be Sacre, since GU is not as deep at the 4 and 5.

former1dog
03-07-2007, 08:09 AM
The answer to the question, I think, depends unfortunately on some unresolved circumstances surrounding a couple of suspended players.

Time will tell.

Nevtelen
03-07-2007, 08:17 AM
No matter what happens, I'd say Sacre, mainly because of depth issues. I hope he's ready for D-I. Even if Josh is back, we could still use him at the 5 and Josh at hte 4.

jazzdelmar
03-07-2007, 08:43 AM
Will any red shirt? Gray may be the most ready, but isnt his spot crowded? If Daye is the highest rated by others, why wont he play at the 4?

former1dog
03-07-2007, 08:47 AM
Will any red shirt? Gray may be the most ready, but isnt his spot crowded? If Daye is the highest rated by others, why wont he play at the 4?

In regards to Gray, I was thinking the same thing. Crowded spot at the 2.

Daye, I believe is a natural 3. Given his skinny stature, 4 spot would be tough on him. Like Downs this year, though, I guess he'd do in a pinch.

23dpg
03-07-2007, 09:13 AM
Just from the reports, it might be Ira Brown who is the most ready to play next year. I envision sort of a Pendo role for him. He is undersized but looks strong.

BobZag
03-07-2007, 09:14 AM
Ira "look at those snappers" Brown should get the most PT to start out with, then it'll be a toss-up between Daye and Gray. I think Sacre will take longer, as do most 7-footers.

That's my take.

thickman1
03-07-2007, 09:53 AM
I'd guess Gray will have a role like Pargo did during his freshman year. If Austin is as good as advertised he could play a 3/4 role. With him and Micah on the floor at the same time it'd cause nightmares for defenses.

tyra
03-07-2007, 10:00 AM
My math suggests a lot of people are "spending" about 300 minutes of player time per game but there are only 200 minutes. Lots to learn before next year, however: Will Josh be back? Can LG play? Who among the current returning scholarship holders will depart? Who will develop and who won't?

ZagManFan
03-07-2007, 10:04 AM
OK, so answer me this. If Daye were to have gone to like a UNC or TEX, would he playing right away at those programs?

If there has ever been a freshman to jump right in and start at GU would it not be Daye?

I agree with BZ in that Ira is the most ready player coming in. He likes 32 years old and built like a *^%$# brickhouse. Of course he will be playing. Few is very loyal to his Seniors and I admire that, but there does come a time when the incoming class may be better than some of the seniors. So what do you do?

Here is my starting 5 come March next year. Not a lot different than what we have now.

Pargo
Bouldin
Downs
Pendo
Kuso or Heytvelt

Not saying that will be our best linup, but knowing Few and his loyalty to Pendo and Kuso they will be starting and I don't blame him one bit.

Depending on who redsirts, I would predict all freshman that are playing will get 16-24 minutes a game next year.

Zag509
03-07-2007, 10:09 AM
Guts and determination could mean a lot as well. If some of the new guys come in and dont work as hard as they can, Few wont start...or maybe wont even play them regardless if they are better the existing players.

Kiddwell
03-07-2007, 12:00 PM
Assuming Heytvelt and Theo Davis return, I see the following ultimate line-up, that is, the mid-season & post-season one (with extraordinary depth coming off the bench):

PG - Pargo
SG - Boudlin
SF - Downs
PF - Heytvelt
PF - Theo Davis

(Yikes! Can you believe that talent?)

Who might redshirt?

I think Sacre is a legit center right out of the box. So I don't think he'll redshirt (sort of, but not exactly like Hawes at UW). Austin Daye is (according to the hype) waaay too good to redshirt, although that does create a bit of a logjam at SF. (Maybe move Daye over to SG occasionally to strike horror in the hearts of opposing teams!)

Ira Davis (SF/PF) plays because he's advertised as a monster b-baller(mature too).

So who redshirts?

I'm in the minority here (given the above opinions), but I've been thinking Stephen Gray is the most likely redshirt. Three players available for point (PMAC, Pargo, Bouldin); four players or more available for shooting guard (PMAC, Pargo, Bouldin, maybe Downs, maybe Ira). I dunno. Given the wealth at the Two, wouldn't it be worthwhile to redshirt Stephen?

Final thought: How I hope Larry Gurganious gets and stays healthy! First, for his own sake. Second, 'cause he's a stud rebounder and defender. I really enjoyed watching him in '05-'06.

:]

lothar98zag
03-07-2007, 12:05 PM
My 2 cents - I'd be shocked if any of the 4 newcomers redshirt

23dpg
03-07-2007, 12:26 PM
OK, so answer me this. If Daye were to have gone to like a UNC or TEX, would he playing right away at those programs?

If there has ever been a freshman to jump right in and start at GU would it not be Daye?

I agree with 23DPG in that Ira is the most ready player coming in. He likes 32 years old and built like a *^%$# brickhouse. Of course he will be playing. Few is very loyal to his Seniors and I admire that, but there does come a time when the incoming class may be better than some of the seniors. So what do you do?

Here is my starting 5 come March next year. Not a lot different than what we have now.

Pargo
Bouldin
Downs
Pendo
Kuso or Heytvelt

Not saying that will be our best linup, but knowing Few and his loyalty to Pendo and Kuso they will be starting and I don't blame him one bit.

Depending on who redsirts, I would predict all freshman that are playing will get 16-24 minutes a game next year.


Fixed it.

Zags4life
03-07-2007, 12:40 PM
Pargo
Bouldin
Downs
Pendo
Kuso or Heytvelt

Not saying that will be our best linup, but knowing Few and his loyalty to Pendo and Kuso they will be starting and I don't blame him one bit.

I can't imagine a scenario in which any of the incoming frosh would contribute what Pendo does now and will, in all probability, contribute even more of next season. Raw talent is one thing, but in terms of basketball IQ, offensive efficiency, and all-out effort, Pendo is pretty tough to top.

kylasdad
03-07-2007, 01:14 PM
I agree with zags4life, I can't imagine a way pendo isn't starting next year. Good luck to the coaches figuring out minutes and how all that will shake out.

ZagManFan
03-07-2007, 03:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZagManFan
OK, so answer me this. If Daye were to have gone to like a UNC or TEX, would he playing right away at those programs?

If there has ever been a freshman to jump right in and start at GU would it not be Daye?

I agree with 23DPG in that Ira is the most ready player coming in. He likes 32 years old and built like a *^%$# brickhouse. Of course he will be playing. Few is very loyal to his Seniors and I admire that, but there does come a time when the incoming class may be better than some of the seniors. So what do you do?

Here is my starting 5 come March next year. Not a lot different than what we have now.

Pargo
Bouldin
Downs
Pendo
Kuso or Heytvelt

Not saying that will be our best linup, but knowing Few and his loyalty to Pendo and Kuso they will be starting and I don't blame him one bit.

Depending on who redsirts, I would predict all freshman that are playing will get 16-24 minutes a game next year.


Fixed it.




S:allhail: orry to have left you out, but BZ responded right after your post. Will you forgive me?

CDC84
03-07-2007, 03:17 PM
However you slice it, Gonzaga is probably looking at a 10-11 man rotation next season.

Here's a question:

Should the Zags consider running a Calipari/Pitino type deal and use a lot more full court pressure to create turnovers and easy scoring opportunities? Not only will GU have the depth to give plenty of rest to tired players, but they will have a level of athleticism on next year's team that they've never really seen. While some guys will be more athletic than others, there will be no slow pokes in next year's main rotation. If wouldn't want to emulate Vance Walberg's way of doing things - I still like how GU runs its basic halfcourt offense...but might GU do some things differently?

Any thoughts?

sanfranzagsguy20
03-07-2007, 03:33 PM
cdc...i have been pushing for the zags to get out of their 2-3 zone since the butler game...it has been our downfall on more than one occasion this season...i do realize however that with our personel this year..full court pressure wasn't ideal with guys like mallon and even raivio in there..who can play quality d in a half court set but arent your ideal athletes in a full court pressure scheme...

i would LOVE to see gonzaga play ANY type of pressure d next year...it would give us even more of a chance to run and we wouldnt let teams get comfortable in their offense...we saw butler and scu and some other teams get too cozy on offense and burn us...i think scu is a quality squad but they werent that great...more of a bad matchup for us more than anything...in any event if we dont put more pressure on defense next year with all our athletes...something is definately wrong...if we're sitting in a 2-3 next year...well..i dont want to imagine...

we have the potential to dominate in the next few years on both ends of the floor...but only if we turn up the heat on d...

roxdoc
03-07-2007, 03:49 PM
With the depth and atleticism that we will have next year, hopefully we won't have to be collapsing people from our zone into the paint to protect our prize big from picking up too many fouls. I agree we should be able to do a lot more press and man D.

tyra
03-07-2007, 04:09 PM
Has Coach Few ever run a 10 or 11 man rotation? I can't recall him doing that. I suspect that anything above 8 or 9 men gets tricky with issues like chemistry , rhythmn and playing time jealousy, etc. But I still suspect this is a case of some people not getting minutes that this Board assumes will get minutes. I remember last summer when the Board thought Burgess would be a more regular mlinute contributor, for example.

roxdoc
03-07-2007, 04:27 PM
GU'sr greatest challenge next year won't be with players capabilities, it will be with the coaching - keeping our present chemistry, perhaps learning how to play a bigger line-up, 2 platoon??? system. In the past the staff has had a tendency to pick the "best" couple of players and just pound the ball to them. Now with our talent level rising (we are already seeing it this year) this may not be the best approach.

Bulldog
03-07-2007, 04:30 PM
What a problem to have, too many allstars on one team. What will we do?

zagmantis2001
03-07-2007, 04:51 PM
All kinds of things can happen. This year, we were debating the depth issue because we had: Davis, Downs, Heytvelt, Burgess, LG, Foster, etc. etc.

Those "depth" problems went away with injuries, red shirt, playing time, arrests etc. On paper, there are too many players for not enough minutes. That may not be the case later with injuries, playing ability, or just life.

Russell Bevan
03-07-2007, 05:48 PM
Friends,

Starting:
Pargo, no question
Bouldin, no question
Downs, no question
Pendo, Few loves to start seniors
Starting Center is the big question.

We have no clue about Josh or Theo. Kuso will make a big leap up in ability after his first year in the program and he will be a senior. Foster is improving, but I doubt he will be ready to start. Sacre is a mystery. Ira is a 3/4 in the Pendo mold.

Who is the first guard off of the bench? PMAC or Gray? PMAC's minutes are going to be limited and I expect Gray to get serious minutes by mid season. Pargo & Matt will get Dickau & Blake like minutes if healthy.

Micha is the primary 3 and Daye comes in for him. Larry G is in the same position as PMAC and its a tough one, same for Burgess. I wonder if they, LG and Burgess come back?

Pendo and Ira will play the 4, Theo might get some time if he is around.

If Josh is here he and Kuso divide time with Sacre getting minutes. Foster will have to earn his time at practice and become a fighter.

Our bigs lack experience, Josh has a total of one season on the floor, like Kuso, that is all we have for veteran leadership in the paint, but we will be OK as long as Josh and Theo can play.

If we stay healthy and Josh and Theo come back we should be a top 10 team by the end of the year, the following year top five or six.

All the best,
Russell

sanfranzagsguy20
03-07-2007, 06:35 PM
with all of these players...quality players who know their talent level and know they could be starting elsewhere...i think we should all brace for at least one transfer...ideally all of these kids would want to stick around regardless of playing time because they believed they could do something special...but as much as we love these guys...everyone has egos and everyone wants to play...not saying it will happen...but i dont think i would be surprised and i dont think some of you should/will be surprised either...its just the nature of the beast

sittingon50
03-07-2007, 10:01 PM
The Elite 8 team of '99 suited 10 & they all played:

Santangelo, Hall, Frahm, Calvary, Eaton, Dench, Floyd, Nilson, Leisure & M. Spink. Everyone of them contributed.

AllezZags
03-07-2007, 10:04 PM
and I certainly would understand if someone transferred elsewhere for more
PT. It's is probably inevitable.

however, I would be extremely dissappointed to see anyone leave to play for
Romar:o

thespywhozaggedme
03-07-2007, 11:15 PM
Russell,
Please you're parrotting my biggest pet peeve. Ira is listed as 6'4. Odds are he's shorter than his listed height, most athletes are. He was a 3/4 at Phoenix College a D2 juco. He will not "be a 4" at GU, an elite NCAA D1 school. He may spend some time crashing the boards and banging underneath but it will certainly be because of the size of his heart not his height. Ira brown is a small foward.

RebornZag
03-08-2007, 05:29 AM
Who would have thought Downs would be a 4? You never know. Never. This year's team taught me that. The other thing is that you can predict right now that there will be injuries. There almost always are. We were hit extrememly hard this year, and it was good we had so many outstanding athletes. It will certainly be fun watching next year to see who does make it though because there will be a lot of talent coming in. I think the greatest thing about this class coming in is that they are quality people. They won't come in expecting to start and will accept it, and they will understand that if they are going to play at Gonzaga they will all need to be Zags first, and that means a team player, warriors second (and not far behind), and Ninja Warriors third (and not far behind). :D :D

I think Daye is going to be a star. I can hardly wait to see him play.
Sacre seems pretty awesome to me. He will be a star.
I think Gray can play if he is a great defensive player. The new guys will need to learn quickly that we have plenty of offense, and if they want to play they will need to stand out on defense. Raivio is a great defensive player, and is not given credit for that. 3rd or 4th all time in steals at GU. Gray needs to know that. The new Zag that can shoot 3's and play D will play next year....

Starters: Pendo, Kuso, Pargo, Bouldin & Downs: How could you not start them next year after what they've done for us this year? Few's greatest quality is loyalty...I like that about him. It's old fashioned....

I think Josh and Davis will have to fight it out with the incoming Freshman if they come back to GU? Sounds like Josh is planning to. I haven't heard about Davis yet...

Out of the Freshman coming in I think Daye will play the most, followed by Sacre, Gray will fight it out with PMAC. If PMAC comes ready to play next year Gray will redshirt. If PMAC continues to play like he did this year then Gray will play. I don't really know enough about Ira yet. I'm more interested in his ability to play Defense and Rebound then I am in his ability to dunk and hit three's. :D

2Zags3Pups
03-08-2007, 03:52 PM
How do you guys think that the conversations went on the Carolina message board prior to this season. They play 12 EVERY game. No one averages more than 30 minutes a game and they have many more highly rated recruits than GU. It all depends on the coaching staff and how they massage the egos. The thing that I do like is that it seems that most of these incoming and current Zags have good, quality personalities and characters. I think you can tell a Steven Gray that he needs to sacrifice his scoring his first year or so and concentrate on defense and rebounding. If there ever was a year for the possibility of multiple players having breakout games, I believe next year is it. Any of 10+ players have the ability to score 20+.