The New Zags

[Reborn]

It's become apparent to me that the Zags of today are no longer the Zags of yesteryear. We are no longer the Cinderella story of college basketball. We are now more like a BCS school then a mid-major school who's living the Cinderella story, and is more along the lines of a one and done team in the tournament. A team like Davidson perhaps. Or Western Kentucky...ect.

I believe that Gonzaga is going to have to work hard to change their psychological approach to the game. For years we were the darlings of college basketball, and now everyone wants to see us get upset. This seems to be a bigger factor then many see right now. I think that it had a big part in the Zags getting beaten in the first round by Davidson, and in the championship game of the WCC tournament by San Diego. In both situations the teams that beat us had huge crowds behind them, and you could just sense the upset.

Both games reminded me of the old Zags. You could feel the crowds behind both San Diego and Davidson, and both teams had a star surrounded by very good talent, and to top it off they played as a solid unit. Against Davidson in particular I could really feel the upset coming. They had the energy behind them that's for sure.

This year especially, I felt the Zags, at the end of many games were kind of just holding on and hoping for a victory (as in two of the games against Santa Clara, the San Diego game in the championship and Davidson). For some odd reason I did not feel the Zags had the confidence to finish the game. We have become a team that everyone now wants to beat in order to have a "good" win behind them in order to impress the NCAA tournament seeding committee. Teams, this year, really did seem to outfight and outhustle us, and especially at the end of the game when it counted.

I am not sure what it will take to move forward and become a team that can make a deep run in March. I have a sense that it's going to take something new...something that will be different then what we needed in '99 and '01. Back in those days we may have caught people off guard, and I now think that our players back then lived and played off all the energy that was behind them because we were a Cinderella story. I think it's going to take a different calliber of player, most likely a player with a different psychological make up that we are not used to. I think we may have the beginnings of the kind of player I'm thinking of in Austin Daye and Steven Gray. Only time will tell.

And I think it's going to take a change in our coaching philosophy and recruiting strategies. In the past we lived and died on offensive firepower. The nature of the game changed in the past couple years, and it's obvious that right now the game has become a game of toughness...much like it was many years ago. The players are now bigger, faster, quicker and tougher I believe. And Gonzaga, right now, really lacks a player or two with that kind of size, speed and toughness. We need a couple guys who have the mentality of "just punishing" their opponents.

Do you all have any ideas in this regard?

[cjm720]

I am not sure what it will take to move forward and become a team that can make a deep run in March.

I'd say a competent big man that can draw defenders and hit free throws. We've missed that the last two years, and with our guard play and the rest of our depth it might be as simple as that. Here's to JH stepping up big in 2008.

GO ZAGS!!!!!!!

[TCZag]

Thank you Reborn.

I was just having this same discussion last week after the loss to Davidson and it can to same conclusion. The overwhelming option was that these “New Zags” really have NO SENSE OF URGENCY. Yes we are more talented than ever but it is the nature of people to get a little complacent with what they have and then begin to expect it. Back in 98-00, those guys believed that this may never happen to them again. They knew that if they did not win the conference tournament, they were not getting invited to the dance. They realized how special and blessed they were to be where they were at. They knew that they did not have the talent that those other teams did, however they were going to fight and claw for ever inch they could get and maximize what ever talent they did have. I'm not saying that these “New Zags” are not humble or tough, because we have seen at time that they are. What I am saying is that they suffer from a lack of a sense of urgency.

So what happened to having a TEAM of guys who “embody what this program is all about”. Back in 98 - 00 we has a lot of players who were described as that. Right now, the only true one we have left (Pendo) is leaving. I hope more that a little bit of his desire, direction, heart, and sense of urgency is left with next year’s team. I want to see a TEAM of guys who "emboyd what this program is all about" like Pendo did.

I wish the best for next years team, so I will send a little bit of advice that my grandfather (Gonzaga Grad, and former Gonzaga basketball player) gave me.

“Son, enjoy every minute of what you have and experience because you can never know when it will all end. So don’t take anything for granted and fight for those things that you love.”

[johnwzag]

Great guards are awesome and we have them. We need the big man to step up. I miss JP. We need a JP. Josh can come close to that next season.

[dim4sum]

long-term recruiting

What might hurt long-term is Seattle U's rise next year to division 1 ranks.
Whether you like it or not Seattle is more of a draw than Spokane. I'm looking for Seattle U to pick up a lot of under the radaar players that ordinarilly might consider Gonzaga. The kind of under the radaar guys like Calvary, Santangelo were in the late 1990s. Or Will Conroy types who want to play close to home.

[MDABE80]

Well, maybe so Dim. And while Seattle U is spending the next 10 years trying to compete with UW for players, GU continue to ascend to higher regard with more TV, better players ( although I dunno how they could get much better talent wise), consistent rankings in the Top 20, media love, Hopefully MORE NCAA tournament time, etc.
One Final Four or a few Elite eights will make losts of kids eyeball the Zags....hard. Spokane will never be Seattle.just won't. That doesn't mean GEG is standing still. PLUS...and I think this might be the biggest factor....Spokane and Gonzaga offer things bigger cities don't. Quietude, great teachers, 4 season weather, skiing, lakes, etc...and an enviroment that makes an experience in Spokane managable. It is Spokane and I've not felt shortchanged. Kids go to college here....that's what they're here for. Many parents understand that and cling to the better,safer components of this particular Jesuit based education.

We don't need under the rader kids any more. Well we do need the heart those kids have. Usually now though, the Staff is looking for the more talented HS players. I think that approach is not quite right but it's the "sizzle" that seems to drive recruitment. For me personally, I like the "not so famous kids". Culture is different than it wss 10 years ago. I'd say go find a Matt Santangelo or a Nilson, Casey..the so-called "under the radar" kids.

I guess this is a bit long winded but I don't think GU should or will suffer. We got the goods here. Not a UCLA or a UNC mind you but we're growing into a national presence. Kids and their parents DO notice nowadays.

[brian_sun]

Seattle U.

Abe: I am sure you have been to Seattle a few times in your life. What's this comment about: Spokane and Gonzaga offer things bigger cities don't. Quietude, great teachers, 4 season weather, skiing, lakes, etc...?

As a BIGGER city, I am sure you are aware that Seattle does have 4 season weather, skiing, LAKES & mountains. We are not one of the most livable cities in the US for no reason.

As a UW grad, I do feel that we lack the kind of family atmosphere that Gonzaga has. But I believe Seattle U offers that in a big city. I am not saying Seattle U will attract the type of talent the GU can attract right off the bat. But over time, if they make a surprise NCAA appearance or 2, the recruits will come.

GU has never recruited well in the Sea-Tac area, considering that is where over half of the state population resides. In your current roster, only Micah Down is from there, but he was actually a transfer from KU. Errol Knight was from Seattle and he was Mr. Basketball in Washington, but he was also a transfer from UW. That's about it. It just shows you that kids in the Sea-Tac area don't usually want to go to Eastern Washington schools right out of high school.

Because of the success GU has over the past decade, Mark Few has changed his recruiting focus. He's more focused on high ranking blue-chippers all across the nation. He's lost focus on international players and JC transfers. He doesn't recruit guys like Ronny Turiaf and JP Bastista any more, because he can compete with KU, UCLA for a Josh Heyfelt, a Austin Daye. Look at what St. Mary did with all their Australian players. They were able to build something quickly and compete with GU this year, and probably next couple years. They've developped an Australia pipe line. They copied what GU did several years ago, and they've found success. There is a reason why Argentina, Spain and Greece have repeatly beaten the all-universe NBA team from the US in the recent world competetions, and that's basketball fundamental. Mark Few needs to fly over to Europe, to South America, to Africa, to Asia and to Australia to find the next big time star in Gonzaga.

[Once and Future Zag]

GU has never recruited well in the Sea-Tac area, considering that is where over half of the state population resides. In your current roster, only Micah Down is from there, but he was actually a transfer from KU. Errol Knight was from Seattle and he was Mr. Basketball in Washington, but he was also a transfer from UW. That's about it. It just shows you that kids in the Sea-Tac area don't usually want to go to Eastern Washington schools right out of high school.

Steven Gray and Casey Calvary are the first two that spring to mind here.

[Sarenyon]

Seattle has 3...

seasons of weather. There really is no "winter" in Seattle. It is more like a continuation of late fall to early spring when compared to most of the rest of the northern sections of the nation.

Oct - May of 75% rainy days... No thanks.

Gray was a huge get from the SeaTac area for GU.

[kitzbuel]

What might hurt long-term is Seattle U's rise next year to division 1 ranks.
Whether you like it or not Seattle is more of a draw than Spokane. I'm looking for Seattle U to pick up a lot of under the radaar players that ordinarilly might consider Gonzaga. The kind of under the radaar guys like Calvary, Santangelo were in the late 1990s. Or Will Conroy types who want to play close to home.

Gonzaga's recruiting has expanded beyond just 'under the radar' players. Without a doubt, getting them is awesome and GU will use them, but it is like relying on a lightning strike. The chances of them developing into top level college players are not as high as those of top recruits. You increase your odds of getting top college players by getting better recruits. GU has been increasingly improving its recruit pool. Regardless, for now GU still can still find room on its roster for the likes of Ira and Will.

[mgadfly]

I don't want any under the radar guys. There is usually a reason why they are under the radar. I'd much rather have the pick of the litter guys.

Also, I think we practice plenty of revisionist history around here. We remember the glory days for all the wins and forget all the frustrating losses. The year we went to the Elite 8 we lost to Detroit, TCU, San Diego (by 16) and a mediocre Pepperdine (along with Kansas & Purdue). As the coaches built that roster and developed those players within the Gonzaga system they failed to qualify for the NCAA tournament (could you imagine if that happened now?).

At least for me, those under the radar years were not nearly as spectacular as everyone seems to remember them. Compare the 90s to the 00's ... I'll take the making the tournament every year more talented but perceived to be not as "hungry" or "urgent" groups we've had lately.

[jim77]

It's become apparent to me that the Zags of today are no longer the Zags of yesteryear. We are no longer the Cinderella story of college basketball. We are now more like a BCS school then a mid-major school who's living the Cinderella story, and is more along the lines of a one and done team in the tournament. A team like Davidson perhaps. Or Western Kentucky...ect.

I believe that Gonzaga is going to have to work hard to change their psychological approach to the game. For years we were the darlings of college basketball, and now everyone wants to see us get upset. This seems to be a bigger factor then many see right now. I think that it had a big part in the Zags getting beaten in the first round by Davidson, and in the championship game of the WCC tournament by San Diego. In both situations the teams that beat us had huge crowds behind them, and you could just sense the upset.

Both games reminded me of the old Zags. You could feel the crowds behind both San Diego and Davidson, and both teams had a star surrounded by very good talent, and to top it off they played as a solid unit. Against Davidson in particular I could really feel the upset coming. They had the energy behind them that's for sure.

This year especially, I felt the Zags, at the end of many games were kind of just holding on and hoping for a victory (as in two of the games against Santa Clara, the San Diego game in the championship and Davidson). For some odd reason I did not feel the Zags had the confidence to finish the game. We have become a team that everyone now wants to beat in order to have a "good" win behind them in order to impress the NCAA tournament seeding committee. Teams, this year, really did seem to outfight and outhustle us, and especially at the end of the game when it counted.

I am not sure what it will take to move forward and become a team that can make a deep run in March. I have a sense that it's going to take something new...something that will be different then what we needed in '99 and '01. Back in those days we may have caught people off guard, and I now think that our players back then lived and played off all the energy that was behind them because we were a Cinderella story. I think it's going to take a different calliber of player, most likely a player with a different psychological make up that we are not used to. I think we may have the beginnings of the kind of player I'm thinking of in Austin Daye and Steven Gray. Only time will tell.

And I think it's going to take a change in our coaching philosophy and recruiting strategies. In the past we lived and died on offensive firepower. The nature of the game changed in the past couple years, and it's obvious that right now the game has become a game of toughness...much like it was many years ago. The players are now bigger, faster, quicker and tougher I believe. And Gonzaga, right now, really lacks a player or two with that kind of size, speed and toughness. We need a couple guys who have the mentality of "just punishing" their opponents.

Do you all have any ideas in this regard?

We don't need a "new" psychology...we need fundamental basketball. We can start by giving that "team airplane" to the women's chess club. Get rid of the "free" grey poupon before every game. Institute the 1000 mile rule...If a game is closer than a 1000 miles we take the bus....if its farther, we fly coach on the cheapest airline availiable.(if you have a peanut allergy, briing you're own snacks) For the first month of practice make Pargo do nothing but make passes(assists) for buckets...no driving to the hoop allowed. Make Steven Gray do his best impression of the "other Stephon" .(Curry) I actually thing this fella could make a career running around screens for catch and shoots. The kid can shoot the lights out. We only let Josh attempt a shot if its going to his left.(or is it the right??)

On a serious note...we have the folks ,we just need to work on our fundamentals. We also need the inside game to return. I think the development of "BIG" Rob has priority one during the off season.....and we need to WORK ON OUR FREETHROWS!

[MDABE80]

Good.........no GREAT.... post Reborn. And I wonder if anyone DOESN"T understand the huge differences between Seattle and Spokane. I mean DUH!!

The point I was making is this: Parents send a kid to GU for many reasons unique to Spokane and Gonzaga . Likewise kids attend school in Seattle/UW for different reasons. I like our kids and I don't know of any who chose GU because UW would or wouldn't have em ie...GU was the "available" or "other" school. No.... they come here because they like it here....refreshing huh?

All these bigtime city UW types ( and yes I've gone to both and lived in both and I don't need pissy lessons about either place from an Internet wanker) sometimes think liveable means Seattle when most people just don't like the wet weather nor the traffic, crowding, high rent, etc. Just don't. Basketball players come to GU because ( till proven otherwise) this is the place.

UW quits when the series is 8-1 favoring GU since GU decided it wanted and converted to big time ball. Doesn't sound like much of anything but it does point out who seems to be superior.

Thus we have a likeable city and a good/great basketball school or 2 in Eastern WA. No contest.

I do think the school here/alums, donors, etc have done everything possible to help the kids get to and from games in expedited fashion as Spokane is a bit out of the way of hourly flights. Get em home to sleep and study better. Build em an arena too. Tutors....grades , attention....TV! And yet it does seem we've developed a different culture of players. Pendo/Kuso are about the only kids from the past 2 years that I recognize that could fit in with the players from 10 years ago. Scored when they could but they ALWAYS made the team better. I just didn't sense that the past 2 years.

I , too, love the zizzle and promise the new kids bring with themselves. Trouble is, it's been promise. And that's the rub. Where's the performance? I really don't care about jumping over chairs, tomahawk dunks, fancy stuff when it doesn't mean much but blips of excitement.........and a 1 st round exit. Even the season has been lackluster. Does anyone think the other teams got better while we stood still?

My solution is that we get better players who want to make sure their teams are better. In Few's system and in the GU culture, it's about the only way we progress. Humility needs to return as does better teamwork. Coaches could use some better in game thinking and implementation of strategies too.
I'm not sure who the in game guy is now. I don't see bright eyes and X's and O's carved into a greaseboard. Talent needs to be steered. Not sure it was this year unless someone favors the concept that things would have been much worse and good coaching saved us but we just didn't know.

Better players, team thinking, better in game coaching and more flexibility. To me, it looked like Few was just angry all the time....and not just on the court. Even in 99 when we lost a few games, we had more fun and still achieved more. I hope we can return to the older habits. It suits us better....just keep the talent.